CCTV cameras will monitor drivers who stray into cycle lanes

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As a driver I am totally confused as to when i can drive in the cycle lane. Some lanes have solid lines and others have broken ones. whats the difference can some driving instructor shed some light and how trhis will now change with regard to the new regulations on fines.

- I M Perry, Woodford, Essex, England, 07/01/2010 18:04
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@ Esther Francis, London
'If there is someone crossing some tend to go round the pedestrian.'

The Highway Code states:
You MUST give way when a pedestrian has moved onto a crossing

This means that it is permissible to pass behind, but not in-front of the pedestrian.

- Cyclist, London, 16/09/2009 08:29
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Safety is just one reason why cycling facilities need to be properly planned and protected from incursion by motor vehicles. Another is that motorists slow down cyclists.

I had to stop 22 times yesterday on my 19 mile trip into central London. At least eight of these were due to traffic lights.

In my previous post I stated 'Every stop is the equivalent of a couple of hundred metres added to the journey.' That was wrong, it's actually a hundred metres. Google Why cyclists wont stop

Accordingly, those traffic light stops added an extra 800 metres. Don't forget, that I encountered approximately the same on my way home!

So that's an extra and completely unnecessary 1600 metres! Add to that the gusting headwind yesterday, and it's little wonder I felt tired when I got home!

Little wonder that some cyclists RLJ.

Traffic lights need to be phased for cyclists. A cyclist has to expend about 20 times as much energy as a pedestrian in order to reach his normal journey speed. A car driver isn't affected apart from using a little extra fuel, especially since much more than that will be wasted in traffic jams. Motorists waste far more fuel by racing away at the lights. I saw both motorists and motorbikers doing this and speeding outside the rush-hour.

PS Unless you're a cyclist you're unlikely to appreciate what this extra effort means.
PPS If you disagree with the PS, Google Dunning-Kruger Effect, which will explain why.

- Cyclist, London, 15/09/2009 21:37
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Motorists,
Please remember that cyclists are individuals, the misbehaviour of one or several is not the behaviour of the whole group.

As a cyclist who tries to obey the rules, I detest Red Light Jumping, but on the other hand, Advanced Stop Lines [ASLs] are almost always full of cars or motorcycles. It's a pleasant surprise to find an ASL that's empty. The ASL is there to allow cyclists to get away first, but if it's full of motor vehicles, that isn't possible. I feel that's one reason for RLJ.
I say fine the motorists in ASLs.

Traffic lights should be phased for cyclists. Every stop is the equivalent of a couple of hundred metres added to the journey.

Riding on the pavement. It's wrong.
Riding the wrong-way in one way streets [without contraflow lane]? It's wrong.
Riding without lights? It's wrong.
These are all fineable offences.

If you're a cyclist, please don't do these things. Please also be particularly careful near long vehicles especially bendy buses and large goods vehicles.
google lorries and towns don't mix.

As for the cycle lanes, they're often a dangerous joke.

- Cyclist, London, 15/09/2009 16:05
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I have a perfect solution...if people are in such oppostion to cyclists defying road rules, and want them to follow the same rules that motor vehicles follow, then cyclists should take up the same amount of space on the road!!! Why confine yourself to a small lane and be run over by a motorvehicle (or god forbid, have to avoid a collision with a pedestrian who walks infront of a cycle because they are jaywalking, causing the cyclist to come to a sudden halt and attempt to prevent themselves from being propelled of the cycle) when we could take up a whole car lane!!! Cycle saftey is an issue!!! Perhaps the government start thinking sensibly and making better cycle lanes with barriers (like on Southwark Bridge) so that we can all be safe!!

- Frida, London, 11/09/2009 10:30
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It's about time this polluted city started being cycling friendly. I find it hard to believe how anti-cyclist this city is at a time of high oil prices and all of the political rhetoric about going green.

Just remember that cyclists mean less cars, loss pollution and less demand for oil. I don't cycle at all any more but am open minded enough to not want to discourage those that do want to cycle and do their bit for the environment.

- Gary, London, 25/07/2008 13:08
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This is bad news for motorcyclists, who use the space at the front of traffic queues for the same reason cyclists do - it's safer to be in front of the cars than next to them. Some of these boxes are legal for both sorts of bikes, others aren't. This move could inadvertantley (or deliberately?) make filtering illegal for bikers.

- Gina Hill, London, UK, 01/08/2007 23:20
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There will be more cameras that people at this rate soon. We already have more cameras than anywhere else in the world, and yet we either all sit back and do nothing and buy the spin it is to cut crime accidents or terrorism.
Makes one wonder if us the public are just plain stupid in this country. Those that seek to control our every move, must be laughing there heads off.

- Graham, Southend, 25/07/2007 01:59
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Who cares what the AA think about cycling and cycle lane enforcement? It isn't down to them whether it is acceptable or not. They would be better off advising their members on obeying the highway code, not making excuses for law breakers and condoning non-enforcement.

- Austen, London, 24/07/2007 21:49
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What if a car breaks down in the middle of the road and the only way around it is to drive through the cycle lane? I suppose we will still be issued with a ticket and then have to attend an appeal hearing to get the fine waived because that is what is expected from the motorist nowadays. Thanks TFL for suggesting yet another fee to be added to the cost of motorist in London!

- Fontayne, London, 24/07/2007 21:15
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Absolutely agree with Carman Jones of London. I have the fortune to be able to walk to work, but only on few trips do I not encounter testosterone-charged young geezers who need to boost their egos by running red lights, riding the wrong way up one-way streets and mounting pavements.

- Annabelle, London, 24/07/2007 20:58
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We really dont need yet more CCTV in this country - we already have more that anywhere else and its oppressive. Better to foster more responsibilty by all road users rather than nanny them and rummage in their wallets. I cycle drive a car and ride a motorbike so am not biased either way.

- Steve, Hereford, 24/07/2007 20:26
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Yes, it's a good idea, as long as it's enforced. I hope the police will also do more to fine the cyclists who routinely trespass on the pavement (even if there are police nearby they nearly always ignore this) as pedestrians have as much of a right to safety as cyclists do.

- Lindsay, London, 24/07/2007 19:59
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Cyclist breaks the law also, and they do it because they are not monitored. They pay no form of road tax, after all they are using the road to get from a-b. I Agree with Carmen, how are cyclist monitored when they break the red light, mount the pavement, fail to stop at zebra crossings. If there is someone crossing some tend to go round the pedestrian.

I drive quite often and even when there are traffic control cycle lanes, some of them actually fail to use them, but instead would use the lane the cars are in cause motorist to stop suddenly.

All cyclist should have to be registered and they should have to provide their name and address, so that when they break the law they to should be fined. There should not be one rule one and another for motorist, they are using the road and therefore they should have to follow the highway code laws also. We all have a responsiblity to drive/cycle safely on the streets.

- Esther Francis, London, 24/07/2007 18:00
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Another barmy money making scheme to extract money from individuals as somebody whom has family and friends living in London and regularly stays in London I am amazed that we allow such schemes to become law.

So long as the public allow councils to treat them with disdain then they will continue to do so.
We have parking fines, fines for straying into box junctions congestion charges, now this welcome to the future you haven't got one.

- Dil, Manchester UK, 24/07/2007 16:35
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I want a BMW lane.

- Bj, London, England, 24/07/2007 15:37
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"Drivers would be fined even if they inadvertently drifted into a cycle lane when passing a vehicle turning right."

Just as with bus lanes, this is totally stupid. What's the point of sitting behind a car waiting to turn right when there is empty road space on your left - as long as it is empty. I reckon many bus lane cameras are deliberately sited to cover right turn situations.

- David, London, United Kingdom, 24/07/2007 15:33
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"And can we expect that cyclists who ride on pavements and run red lights will also be monitored and fined?" - said carman.

Of course you can't... no license plates on bikes, which means that they're practically immune from any laws of the road.

TfL are taking the mickey here. This will cause further congestion with cars backed up behind slow cyclists with cars entirely unable to make progress when there are queues of traffic waiting to turn.

- Neil, Notting Hill, 24/07/2007 15:17
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Will these cameras also help stop the cyclists going through red lights where it's the pedestrians right of way? I am more likely to be seriously hurt by a cyclist than I am a car nowadays and surely the laws of the road apply to everyone!?

- Anon, London, 24/07/2007 14:59
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How generous of the AA to offer to accept some surveillance on cycle lanes if those that are poorly used are taken away. For the sake of cyclists drivers need to be fined. The pressure of vehicles on London roads is so great that some drivers are willing to do anything illegal to their advantage knowing that the chances of getting caught are remote. If they are going to get caught they are less likely to do it and will act in a safer manner. The safer the roads are the more likely cyclists are to use them rather than the footpath. If cyclists have a safe box ahead of the traffic they are more likely to stop at the lights. Good work transport for London.

- David, London, 24/07/2007 14:48
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If this will actually make cyclists use cycle lanes instead of pavements, I'm all for it. I'm tired of cyclists screaming along the pavements endangering pedestrians, jumping red lights and going the wrong way down one-way streets. How many of them are ever prosecuted for this selfish and dangerous behaviour?

- Annette, London, 24/07/2007 14:22
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Well done Carman. I have lost count of the amount of times I have been "mowed" down by selfish, ignorant cyclists. They never stop at red lights, they believe the pavement is an extension of the road purely for them, its about time they brought in fines for them and enforced them.

- Carol, Grays, Essex, 24/07/2007 14:06
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I was under the impression that this was already happening so I can't say I'm too distressed - though I don't think people should be fined for accidentally and momentarily crossing into a cycle lane in the absence of cyclists if their maneouvre clears the junction and keeps traffic moving. Carman Jones has a point, though - perhaps we should consider registering road-going cycles so that they can be identified and fined when they ignore red lights. And, yes, it would be good if adult cyclists were kept off the pavements - that's a case of enforcement, not new regulations.

- Suzanne, London, 24/07/2007 13:59
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"Drivers would be fined even if they inadvertently drifted into a cycle lane when passing a vehicle turning right."

What nonsense!

You don't inadvertently drift into another lane when passing a stationary vehicle turning right. You manouvre around it. If you do anything, "inadvertently" in a car you are probably dangerous and shouldn't be driving.

This is a problem. Not just for cyclists, for other road users too. It's the same thing when a bus stops, at a bus stop, and drivers in the following traffic think they have some automatic right to swing out into the lane of oncoming traffic, instead of waiting for the bus to move off.

Just wait, in both cases!

- Md, London, 24/07/2007 13:41
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I cycle to and from work in central London every day. Cycle lanes are worse than useless. TFL should get rid of them entirely. They encourage a false sense of security.

Cycle boxes at traffic lights, however, are very useful. Drivers are usually quite considerate and leave the boxes clear. Motorcyclists, however, think that the boxes are for their benefit. Anything to stop them using them would be a good idea.

- Jl, London, 24/07/2007 13:33
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Currently most cycle lanes are a waste of time as they are used as parking spaces, also pedestrians think they are an extension to the pavement.

- Ian Mursell, London, 24/07/2007 13:15
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Another revenue raising exercise dressed up as safety issue. How about repairing the pot holed roads so that cyclists don't come off their bikes when they hit them?

- Andrew, Harrow, UK, 24/07/2007 13:15
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There is never ever enforcement of cyclists riding on pavements, particularly by youngsters. Whilst the onus is so clearly on punishing drivers in every conceivable way in London, it would be nice to know there was some reciprocity where cyclists are concerned. Fat chance.

- Woddis,, London, 24/07/2007 13:14
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"Drivers would be fined even if they inadvertently drifted into a cycle lane when passing a vehicle turning right."

"Inadvertently" by turning the steering wheel? Quite right too - this is a classic car/cycle accident spot, where a careless motorist veers left without looking and kills someone's son or daughter stone dead.

- Steve, Leeds UK, 24/07/2007 13:06
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Target cyclists who put pedestrians' lives at risk by riding on pavements; the wrong way on one-way streets; ignoring red traffic lights and pedestrian crossings.

- Warren Alexander, London, UK, 24/07/2007 12:47
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I could be okay about this if bikes displayed registration numbers and cyclists became accountable.
I have never heard a rational argument against them being monitored, it would even aid the emergency services.

- Frank H., London, 24/07/2007 12:45
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Another tax on the motorist.

- Casper, London UK, 24/07/2007 12:36
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Does Nick Lester seriously think we need yet more cameras? He should be looking at making better use of existing cameras and asking why the police only handed out 3 tickets last year.

- Andy, London, 24/07/2007 12:23
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It would be good if this were actually enforced, especially for the cycle boxes. Taxis, motor cycles. all kinds of cars and even a police car or two I have found regularly in the cycle box when I am waiting for the lights to change.

It is rare for me to find a clear cycle box. MV users in this space make it difficult for cyclists to line up for a right hand turn and cars straying in or parking in the cycle lanes make for dangerous situations for cyclists as we have to move out into the main line of traffic, slowing down other road users.

- Merrie, London, 24/07/2007 12:21
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It's the cyclists who should be spied on! I have come to the conclusion that they are all red/green colour blind. It is time that irresponsible cyclists are bought to book for going over red lights and are fined HEAVILY for doing so. They are the dangers on the road.

- Minime, Southend, England, 24/07/2007 12:09
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Excellent idea. As a cyclist, I am sick to death of finding the ASL boxes chock full of cars and motorbikes, when they are supposed to be there to help cyclists get away safely. And Carman, I think you'll find that there is an ongoing crackdown on cyclists that jump red lights and ride on the pavement - with City police particularly keen to issue fines. Shame the same cannot be said for the many motorists I see who also jump red lights, use their mobiles while driving and don't bother using their indicators. I think you'll find they are far more of a danger to pedestrians and cyclists alike.

- Lucy, Surbiton, UK, 24/07/2007 12:08
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200 cyclists were fined for red light jumping in the last month alone.Number of car drivers fined for using cycle lanes? Three.

Yet car drivers kill 3500 a year and cripple thousands more. Car drivers routinely flout the mobile ban, speed, overtake recklessly and drive drunk, drugged or overtired.

It's about time this imbalance was redressed- ASLs are ignored by the majority of drivers who make the roads far more dangerous.

- Susan Porter, London, 24/07/2007 12:07
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I would like to comment on the fact that motorists may be fined "even if they inadvertently drift into a cycle lane when passing a vehicle turning right". I have narrowly escaped being knocked off my bike countless times by drivers impatient to pass a vehicle waiting to turn right. Without looking behind they accelerate, swerve to the left (ie, into the bike lane), and try to nip round the waiting vehicle. This is not 'inadvertently drifting into a bike lane'; it is bad, dangerous and inconsiderate driving.

- Colin, London, UK, 24/07/2007 12:04
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Why are they wasting money on this? Why not produce proper cycle lanes instead as then you will get more cyclists to take to the street as they will feel safer. Having a fine is not going to improve the situation. Money was wasted on advertising regarding motorists using their mobiles while driving. Amazing how this seems to have increased instead of decreasing.

- Sarah, London, 24/07/2007 12:04
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My goodness when will all this terrorism of the motorist end, criminals wander round London with guns casually shooting anyone who crosses them, what do the authorities do? Nothing. Muggers and burglers are given the same easy-going treatment, but if you are a motorist and break the law well it's a different matter, fined and hounded by all. What a mad country we live in.

- Brian, Wiltshire, 24/07/2007 12:02
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It's about time something like this was done. It's not much fun finding a white van inching forward into the green box.

No doubt someone will come along in a minute and moan about cycles, red lights and pavements (yawn), but cyclists have been responisible for, I believe, the death of just one pedestrian in the last 7 years (but still people love their cars).

- Brian, Telford, 24/07/2007 11:58
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Exactly Carmen, last week I was almost run into by a cyclists who completely ignored the red light at a pedestrian crossing and who when questioned about this by me just responded by giving me a rude finger gesture. Then this morning whilst driving I had to do quite a lot to avoid a cyclist coming around a corner the wrong way on a one way street. Who do cyclists think they are to break all the trafic rules and get away with it? Unacceptable!

- Julia Graham, London, 24/07/2007 11:56
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It's about time drivers got out of the cycle boxes at junctions. A fine will stop them from breaking the law.

- James, London, 24/07/2007 11:48
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And can we expect that cyclists who ride on pavements and run red lights will also be monitored and fined?

- Carman Jones, London, 24/07/2007 11:35
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