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Return of Routemaster in doubt says transport chief
Katharine Barney, Evening Standard15.05.08
The Mayor's plans for a newgeneration Routemaster may not happen, his new transport boss admitted today.
Kulveer Ranger, Boris Johnson's director of transport policy, said that a design competition would be launched - but if no bid was good enough they would look again at the pledge.
He added that although Mr Johnson is very keen to bring in a new-style bus in place of bendy buses, they would not press ahead with the idea for the sake of it.
Mr Johnson made phasing out bendy buses a priority, initially saying new Routemasters would cost £8million to run with conductors. However, he later admitted the figure would be nearer £100million.
Mr Ranger said: "It's almost a fact to say Londoners are not happy with bendy buses. We want to develop a bus that is safe, reliable and has that extra bit of style and panache.
"The Routemaster was, and indeed still is, an icon and we need something that has the same iconic status."
But in a departure from Mr Johnson's policies, Mr Ranger said the new design would not necessarily be " hopon, hop-off" with a conductor, as on the old Routemasters.
He said: "Whether or not we have a conductor depends on the design of the bus. We want people to be creative. Our brief is very flexible.
"Anything is possible. We'll set some sort of ball-park figure but we can't say how much it will cost at this time. Let's see what comes back.
"The plan is to have them on the roads by the end of his first term but we're not doing this just for the hell of it. If we find there are initially no suitable bids we will review [the policy].
"A major problem people have is the need to stick to things even if it is clear it is not working - like the 10p tax."
He said any plan would have to have clear benefits and be viable. In a visit last week, mayor of New York Michael Bloomberg also warned Mr Johnson to get rid of any manifesto pledges immediately which looked unlikely to work.
Mr Ranger said his work would begin with reviewing and undoing the mistakes Ken Livingstone had made before any radical changes could start.
He said this meant reviewing the extension of the congestion zone.
"The congestion charge has become a bit of a muddle. It's not clear what the purpose of it is and there have been a lot of conflicting reports," he said.
"We will consult people who live [in the extension zone] and nearby. We will have a clear approach to things.
"That Ken said the consultation was a farce was disrespectful. The Mayor is supposed to be representative and we have to listen to people."
Mr Ranger will join the team in a few weeks after finishing his job as a senior management consultant for the Nichols Group.
He went on: "I'm taking lots of deep breaths at the moment and trying not to drink too much coffee. It is a huge challenge. I'm not sure Ken Livingstone got everything wrong but we will have to unpick a lot of things."
He will advise transport commissioner Peter Hendy on Mr Johnson's policies and will also be working with previous mayoral candidate Steve Norris in his new position on the board of Transport for London.
Reader views (38)
i agree conductors would be costly why cant the bue tickets before bording and punch machines date time on board and any one fiddling get a massive fine
- Cliv Horner, melksham wiltshire
maybe two door double decker buses would be great, as conductors worked well on this and you could easy use oaster cards as they did on the later times of the r.m and there would be easy access for disabled, and less time for for driving to wait for people looking for there passes , oaster cards or even fares
- Des Harris, croydon , surrey
Yes, we do have Oyster cards so at first blush it looks like having bus conductors would be an obvious waste. But think not only of disabled access but also of fare dodging (yes, even with oysters) and the often malevolent atmosphere on the buses these days. Bus conductors not only help to stop fare evasion but also act as a reassuring presence/disincentive to rowdiness that the London transport system so desperately needs. Having them would also be entirely consistent with Boris’s strategy to reduce serious crime but tackling low-level disorderliness. Furthermore, if they could make the old Routemasters greener then I’m sure they’d be immensely popular and not just for reasons of nostalgia/London identity.
- Adam James Tebble, London, England
Ct, SE London if the conductors trial in the 70s and 80s were successful by now all the conductors would still be around by now, but they are not. I don't see the point of having conductors around now that most bus travellers are carrying Oystercards to my eyes they were the biggest killers, can you imaging how bored the conductors work will be. And another problems with conductors is that bus operators over the years if not decades were struggling to hire more conductors with pay rate not as good as drivers. In other words how or where can you hire more people? who will be willing to do the conductor work? The so-called "pay peanuts get monkeys" springs to mind.
- George, London, UK
Conductors can work quite successfully on ordinary two door double decker buses. For a period in the late 1970's and early 1980's new two door double deckers were introduced on to routes 36 36A 36B 53 and 63 with bus conductors and were very successful. Why not replace the bendy buses with larger tri-axle double deckers with conductors which are readily avaiable in the UK from UK bus body builders like Dennis (Enviro 500) and Wright Bus (Eclipse). These would be very welcomed on to London's busy bus routes.
- Ct, SE London
Boris's plan for a "modern routemaster" was always a piece of incoherent propaganda. If you stick with driver operation then it's already done. Re-introducing conductors will never happen for cost reasons--what would they do, anyway, in the Oyster era? This pledge will go, and more quickly, than Ken's pledge to keep them.
- Mick, London
With all respect to Karl from London, and speaking as someone who used to conduct on and drive Routemasters in service and now owns a preserved one, (RML2271), I correspond quite regularly with someone from London who suffers from cancer and had to stop travelling on the 73 to attend hospital for his chemotherapy treatment after the Routemasters were replaced by Bendy Buses because passengers were packed in like sardines. When RMLs operated on the 73, the conductors made sure he got a seat, that all changed with the introduction of the bendies when he was forced to stand due to lack of seating. Other disabled groups such as the visually impaired have also suffered by the removal of Routemasters, so not every disabled person can use bendies with ease.
I am not insensitive to people with MS as my cousin is now wheelchair-bound with the disease, but I believe an improved "Dial-a-Bus" service would provide a better service for wheelchair users. Thanks to Boris, the bendies will soon be history anyway, and hopefully the new wheelchair accessible RMXLs will be on the road within three years.
- Graham Laurie, Glasgow
I used to work at Transport for London. Bendy buses were a bit of an in-house joke as they were often unreliable. As England has suffered a national identity crisis in recent years, it desperately needs more icons. Most sane people mourned the lost of the red telephone box, the pillar box and the Routemaster. As long as the new design is safe and accessible to all, then it should be applauded. Boris - I salute you!
- Francesca, Tuscany, Italy
Problem with bendies is the misty eyed nostalgists who do not use public transport. Bendies are not suitable for all routes, however they are extremely efficient people movers.
Routemasters have had their day, the last items issued to conductors were personal assault alarms as they were an easy target for any low life wanting a few quid, that combined with open platforms equates to an insurance nightmare, instead of ambulance chasers we will get bus-chasing solicitors.
With modern rules on the design of public transport it will be very difficult to improve on current vehicles.
Berlin has new double deckers with three doors and two staircases good for moving large volumes of people but they are nearly 14m long and unsuitable for tight turns.
Whilst I cannot see any more bendies coming to London I do not see a viable replacement in terms of a new Routemaster.
- Peter, Harrow, London
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the Bendy Bus. My wife has MS and can use them with ease.
- Karl, London, UK
A wholeheartedly applaud the idea of a competition to design a new "Routemaster". It would be a wonderful opportunity for the highly capable UK bus industry, it's designers and also for transport design students, to show what could be done.
I am somewhat puzzled by the the very negative approach that has been expressed to the concept of an exciting advanced bus design, tailored to meet the needs of central London that could hopefully become as iconic as it's famed predecessor whilst meeting future expectations in terms of it's environmental impact and safety.
Why on earth should such a vehicle not be a success and not receive support from the industry & operators?
- Neil Birtley, Coventry, England,
I like the bendy buses, would like to see more of them. Seems like a waste of money to get the routemasters back! And they have to pay salary to two people on each bus, which would increase the costs of running them big time.
- Julie, London
Tory reneging on election promise? - say its not so!
- Billy Blighty, Sydney Australia
The Routemaster was, and is, a great vehicle. I agree that any replacement must be as practical and flexible as the old bus. As for the congestion charge? Reading between the lines does the new mayor plan to scrap it and let London be a free for all for traffic again? In that case forget about new buses, because they won't be able to move around.
- Mark Wright, Milan, Italy
Al, quite right. Exactly how is a cab carrying one person counted as "public transport"? It's a private hire car just as much as a stretch limo.
- John R., London SW
Give the guy a chance. Maybe he will bring back something similar. It's fair to say he wouldn't have had access to the data he does now whilst in opposition to Ken. Frankly anyone who wants to bring back Ken must need their head testing.
All we've got to show for Ken is a congestion charge which doesn't cut congestion, and money being misappropriated left right and centre.
Good luck Boris.
- Samantha, London UK
Londoners were gushing over this when he announced it. I'm not surprised it is in doubt, you've all been taken for fools putting trust in him.
I expect this will be the first in a long line of broken promises and disappointments under Boris. And the Londoners who voted for him deserve what they get.
- Les Ferris, Newcastle
The routemaster is a symbol of London. Don´t miss it. Five years ago, when I went to London with my family, the first thing what we made are a trip in the number 9 line, across Picadilly St, Trafalgar Sq. to Kensington.
- Fernando, Santander Spain
The simple fact is, Ken should not have got rid of the Routemasters in such a hurry in the first place, He should have stuck to his original plan to refurbish the whole fleet with green power units and bought time to develop a decent successor.
The 50 odd Routemasters that did get treated as such were more fuel and emmission efficient than many brand new single deck buses.
None of the modern buses are any great shakes they are all riddled with plus and minuses.
Surely the way forward is to design and develop something that has mostly pluses all round.
Pressure from profit led operators and minority groups undid Kens's original plans and it cost him a lot of votes.
Boris needs to get the right can do attitude team and push it.
Can do and creativity seems to be the one thing, lacking in public service.
- Mike Brandt, London UK
I am not surprised by this, this new routemaster project is likely to be a pipe's dream or a "non-starter" as bus and car makers Volvo said, and personally I do not see the point of a new routemaster if it have no conductors and open platform with only CCTVs, it will be a mirror image of the buses of the DAFs, Volvos, Enviro 400 Tridents that are running on the streets right now, and what about its afterlife? once it reaches its lifespan of service of just 5-14 years in this the most competitive bus service in the country today where when you want to retain existing route(s) in this London bus tendering programme (on service contracts) you might even eventually have to purchase brand new fleet of buses even if they are just five years old in order to make it cost viable. I will not be surprised if the new routemaster project does not go ahead, besides bus manufacturers like Volvo and Alexander Dennis have already distance themselves from this project. Also don't be surprised if Boris says it is all proving much more expensive than he anticipated and there are other more important things he can spend the money on.
- George, London, UK
I am a joint owner of a preserved Routemaster and drive it to many rallies and in many ways it is easier to drive than a car. I would dearly love to see "Son of the Routemaster" but I am sure it will never happen for so many reasons. Our cotton wool society is not mature enough to be trusted to cope with an open platform. Society cannot afford to employ conductors. The cost of tooling-up would have to be spread over quite a number of vehicles such that it would have to appeal to the rest of the UK bus operators. It is a shame really, we no longer have London buses just passenger carrying vehicles.
- Mr M R Knight, Alton, Hants
Why not bring back trolley buses? When I was a boy in the 1950s there were everywhere in London. Clean, quiet and more flexible in operation than trams, they are still the ideal public transport vehicle for a crowded city like London.
- Adrian Gilbert, Tonbridge
What would be a good start is if the bus operators gave the drivers the discretion to open the door and let people off if a bus is stopped in traffic, a passenger has asked to be let off and will step onto the pavement, not into traffic. A little common sense would go a long, long way. I can see that it's not a great idea to have people jumping on and off a moving bus, but at the moment there is nothing more aggravating than being trapped on a bus, 25 yards from your stop, as the world and a fleet of tortoises races past on the pavement.
- Alex, London, UK
I understand that if they don't get any good bids they can't really introduce a new bus but I would be really disappointed if this the project was dropped. Come on Boris - make it happen!
Also the design should have an open platform, it was such a good feature and it would be pointless if the new bus did not have it.
- Edward Bellamy, London, UK
Now why doesn't that surprise Me? We all knew it was a non starter, like most of his crackpot ideas, just loads of London Muppets believed him and voted for him! This is the one thing Boris made a big song and dance about, along with tackling crime. He's just a waste of space, voted in on false hopes and promises. Bring back Ken!
- Bob, Enfield, England
Exactly my point Mark! Nobody can deliver 100% reduction in crime - in a week or in ten years - which is why it was such a stupid thing for him to say, and based on as much fact and research as the rest of his 'promises'.
- Miriam, London UK
You should have been careful what you wished for, now you've got it, in spades. These broken promises are just the beginning of the downward spiral. A consultation about the extension of the congestion charge zone - could the areas affected be Conservative boroughs? It must be payback time. And now we hear he has taken up his old job with the Daily Telegraph at £250,000 a year. That makes 5 part-time jobs he's got, including the Mayoralty and MP for Henley. Nice work if you can get it. At least Ken treated the job with respect and gave 100% to it, not 20% like this chancer.
- Val Daniels, Mijas Costa. Spain
Oh for goodness sake. Some people can't wait to tear the guy to shreds. Rather no Routemaster than press ahead blindly with an imperfect scheme - we get quite enough of those from Labour.
- Pauld, Essex
Bendy buses are fine - I use one every day and can't see a problem with them. On the other hand, if Boris really wants to reduce congestion in Central London and make public transport more reliable, he should bus black cabs from using the bus lanes - most of the traffic jams I get stuck in every day are due to the cabs, not ordinary cars!
- Al, London
Nobody can deliver a 100% reduction in crime, especially not in a week! All they've said is if they can not get a viable design then they can't go ahead. Sounds like common-sense. Something I never heard while Livingstone was in office. If they get rid of the Western Extension they'll have done us all a favour.
- Mark, London, UK
Dr Susan Porter - "An election won with a campaign of empty promises and bare-faced lies." Wait and see. He has hardly started. You probably still think he is a racist.
What is clear is that Livingsonte's bid was an election lost with a campaign of empty promises and bare-faced lies.
- Chas, London, UK
Boris a liar? Why am I not surprised?
- Jonty, London
What's happened to Ken's plans to send a bendy bus around the world for the Olympics?
Maybe Boris could use the money from this to design a new bus.
- Jocky, London
An election won with a campaign of empty promises and bare-faced lies.
- Dr Susan Porter, London
What a surprise! And I suppose the '100% reduction in crime' Boris mentioned might also fall by the wayside on closer inspection?
- Miriam, London, UK
.....ah, the Mayor breaks his first promise! What a surprise!
- Sherry, London
So we were conned.
- Adam Bienkov, London
Please bring back the Routemaster! Making people wait to get on and off buses in slow-moving traffic is madness. Also, the Routemaster was better ventilated, more stable and had a conductor to help people on and off or with their shopping. Modern buses have none of those features and are overheated, under ventilated and festooned with blasted spy cameras.
- Neil, london uk
