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Uproar in Commons as Harman tries to dampen debate on the Speaker
Joe Murphy and Nicholas Cecil8 Dec 2008
THE Government moved to close off debate about the police raid on the Commons today amid rowdy scenes in the House.
Harriet Harman moved that a special committee to investigate the handling of the affair should not meet until after the Scotland Yard probe was over - meaning a delay of months.
It came at the start of a debate that was dominated by furious criticism of the raid and discontent with the way Speaker Michael Martin failed to halt the police at the gates.
The Speaker and his chief official, Serjeant at Arms Jill Pay, allowed Scotland Yard to conduct a search on 27 November without a warrant, and to remove computers and files.
Outspoken critics of the Speaker were joined by former home secretary Charles Clarke. But Labour ministers and MPs rallied to keep him in the post until the next election. Ms Harman claimed the committee could not sit without the risk of prejudicing any future trial of Tory MP Damian Green or alleged whistleblower Christopher Galley.
It would also look as if MPs were "breathing down the police's neck".
But Tory shadow home secretary Dominic Grieve accused her of trying to "fetter Parliament". Tory whip Andrew Robathan said Ms Harman was using "weasel words" for political ends.
Ukip MP Bob Spink was pushed by a Tory backbencher, sparking calls of "retreat, retreat". Veteran Tory Sir Nicholas Winterton accused the parliamentary authorities of being weaker than those in Zimbabwe when having to deal with the police.
Conservative MP Richard Shepherd warned that the "confidence and authority" of Commons was at stake.
Labour MP Bob Marshall-Andrews, who has urged Mr Martin to resign, branded it "wholly inappropriate" that the Government had imposed a three-line whip on MPs during the debate on the police raid.
A Tory amendment to allow a six rather than three-hour debate was defeated by Labour MPs. Former home secretary Mr Clarke earlier dealt a blow to Mr Martin's hopes of clinging to his job beyond the next election, saying the Speaker should have stopped the police raid and that he was wrong to try to blame it on junior officials.
But Home Secretary Jacqui Smith followed the lead set by Gordon Brown by offering "full confidence" in the Speaker.
Reader views (38)
At least the dishonourable Labour stooge and his side-kick Mrs. Pay will go down in the history books as the first officials of the House of Commons to betray the trust placed in them by allowing the police to search an MP's office without even having a search warrant.
- Guy Slatter, Liskeard, Cornwall, 09/12/2008 10:12
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The speaker failed to undertake his duty to protect tradition in the house and opposition members trying to engage in their political legitimate efforts to high light issues of public interet.
Mr Martin, The house speaker should walk from his post as he has lost credibility, and is not worthy of the role, as he failed in his duty , and it really begs questions that he did not act to the fact the Police did not even have a search warrent.(British Politics is in a Bad way indead ).
I have never been politically minded but Mr Martin must stand down as soon as possible as he has lost his integrity, and the confidence of many .
- Keith Hayes, South Wales UK, 08/12/2008 19:30
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As with any Government that remains in power too long, with a very weak opposition, they think they can do what they like. The Conservatives did it and now the Labour Party are doing the same. For the last 30 years we appear to have had nothing more than elected dictatorships in the UK. When will it end!!! The UK electorate deserve a far better standard of management and representation than it has experienced over those years.
- Pedro, Dubai UAE, 08/12/2008 18:42
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When it comes to campaigning for the next General Election, Opposition Partys will have too many Labour-caused embarrassments to remind the electors of!
- Frank28, Hants, 08/12/2008 18:35
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Well, we have only got to stick this out another 18 months then we can dispose of this awful government and most of the Nulabour MPs forever (unless they change the rules and with Meddlesome running the show and pulling all the strings that would not surprise me). In my long life I have never experienced such a deceitful, nasty, sly bunch of liars and cheats who have done more to destroy Great Britain than all our enemies put together since 1066.
- Bob, Cowes UK, 08/12/2008 18:27
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They are a shabby Government and morally bankrupt.
- Tigerail, Lutterworth, 08/12/2008 18:07
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just goes to show that martin is no more than a labour stooge
- John Lowe, london UK, 08/12/2008 17:30
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The whole event has the hand of Mandelson and Campbell on it.. It reeks with the stench of spin, smoke and mirrors and Nu-Liebour is cheapened and discredited thereby. The British electorate will punish this weak and immoral crowd of chancers, to the point, I hope, that they can never be in office again.
- Dave, Glos. UK, 08/12/2008 17:29
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This government has slowly but systematically destroyed the power of the Commons and so our democracy itself. We have the least accountable, least democratic government in the civilised world. We are ruled by a dictatorship headed by 'Enquiry Brown', 'Macavity Brown', 'Prudence Brown'- call him what you will. He is a disgrace to our country and to loyal British people. It is time this bumbling oaf did us all a favour and resigned, taking his pathetic historically illiterate out of touch yes men and women with him!
- Mike Richards, devon uk, 08/12/2008 17:15
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labour seem to go lower and lower, no ethics, no dignity, no morals, dishonest, out of touch this is now vitually a police state
- Paul Connolly, potters bar, 08/12/2008 16:57
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If they sack one they will all go, thats why they wont sack him.
- Dave Smith, Croydon, 08/12/2008 16:49
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Just watched some of the debate. Teresa May was excellent telling it as it is whereas Harman was pathetic.Martin looked very shifty. Why was he in the chair? Surely he should have let a Deputy take over ?
- Mordwinoff, Lisle FRANCE, 08/12/2008 16:44
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Whatever happened to the concept of management responsibility? It is grossly unfair of Mr Martin to devolve blame down to Jill Pay. He is her manager. He is ultimately accountable for her actions. Do people in positions of power no longer accept the responsibility for the actions of those who report to them?
The Speaker should resign if he is an honourable man. But honour is a bankrupt concept in this day and age.
- Edward Thompson, Bedfordshire, 08/12/2008 14:06
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As a Scot, Martin and Brown deeply embarrass me.
The former hates protocol but loves the trappings of power (and is quite happy to try and hide both his and the expenses of his cronies). Brown is a political animal on the darker side, saving his own skin no matter what.
Proud of being Scottish? Certainly. Proud of these two? Give me a break. Time for them to disappear into a black hole.
- Ian Carruthers, ex-pat Scot in Toronto, Canada, 08/12/2008 14:06
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Dicatorship-Stalin would have been proud.
- Jon Kent, Hertford. UK, 08/12/2008 13:45
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If they did a job swap would anybody notice?
- R James, Bristol, 08/12/2008 13:44
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Speaker Michael Martin has yet again proved himself to be entirely out of his depth and unsuitable for his role - he should go
- George, London, 08/12/2008 13:28
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If Martin goes there is no way Brown could bring in a third Labour controlled speaker, and stading up in front of the commons the PM needs all the help he can get.
- Tim, London, 08/12/2008 13:08
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Michael Martin - MP - Scotland
Gordon Brown - MP - Scotland
Alistair Darling - MP - Scotland
Attorney General - Baroness Scotland of Asthal
Say no more. Tartan Mafia strikes again!
- Sandy, London, 08/12/2008 12:54
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Air Miles Martin is a disgrace to the Commons - he should have been sacked ages ago when he tried to block Freedom of Information requests to reveal MPs' expenses, when he'd spent £50,000 of public money on air travel for his wife. She also spent over £4,000 of our money on taxis.
- Susie James, London, 08/12/2008 12:51
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Impartiality is a word not fit for the Labour vocabulary. Not only do we have a policeman investigating the police, but also a committee, loaded with Labour cronies, that's not going to convene for many months, to investigate the Speaker's conduct, denying us all of any form of impartiality in this sordid business.
- Bingham Macnamara, lymington, hants, 08/12/2008 12:49
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It was clear from the start that Gordon Brown and Michael Martin (both Scottish) will look after each other like superglue in their communist camp. It's a disgrace. We need Cameron in.
- Anon, London, 08/12/2008 12:49
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Despicable but no surprise at all. The Speaker should be impartial and Michael Martin is clearly in the Labour camp. Of course Brown wants him there, right in his pocket where he's useful. It hasn't taken long for this country to be turned into a Stalinist regime. Very, very sad and very very true!
- Jan, London, 08/12/2008 12:48
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Brown's intervention to save a Speaker who is not worthy of the job strikes me as the act of a man who feels power ebbing away and who will do anything to convince himself that he is not weak. We can see through you Gordon. To coin a phrase you are weak, weak, weak. A devastated economy will be your legacy and your name will live on for that and that alone.
- James Elliott, Eastbourne UK, 08/12/2008 12:47
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No surprise there,scots stick together.
I just wish they'd do so in Scotland,the country they're so proud of.
- Steve, London, 08/12/2008 12:46
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The stench from this ghastly government is getting worse by the day!And to think they have another 18 months or so before we can throw them out.
- Alan, Chigwell. UK, 08/12/2008 12:40
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Yet more proof, if more were needed, that this government only looks after its own and could not care less about the constitution of this country or the welfare of the British people. How dare they save this corrupt and lying little cheat who cannot do his job properly by asking some very obvious questions of the police.
- Vanessa, London, 08/12/2008 12:11
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'All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others', as George Orwell brilliantly portrayed socialists.
Traditionally, if the Speaker goes he would be expected to resign as an MP too.
If Martin left before the next General Election his parliamentary seat would be immediately open to a bye-election.
Brown needs this like a hole in the head, that's why he's desperately backing Martin to hang on.
And don't forget Labour's good old habitually
'traditional' nepotistic behaviour either, postponing Metal Mickey's departure would allow his son , who else, to be 'shoed-in' by Brown at the next General Election.
- Dave, cumbria, 08/12/2008 11:59
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Martin is partisan, therefore unable to uphold the position of Speaker of the House.
A Speaker must have a true and undiluted determination to see that the House excercises Democracy to the fullest. He has failled. Let him go. This is not a matter for compromise.
- Maria, London, 08/12/2008 11:58
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Martin came from the Labour benches, of course they are going to support him. Equally him allowing the arrest of an opposition front bench MP, just galvanizes the Labour support.
All hail Brother Brezhnev Brown.
- Frank, Home Counties, England, 08/12/2008 11:56
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Isn't this more about Gordon not wanting another by-election in his own backyard? If Speaker Martin was ousted, he would normally leave the Commons and trigger a by-election.
- Lee, London, 08/12/2008 11:48
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Jobs for the boys.
- Albert Swift, Aberdeen, Scotland, 08/12/2008 11:46
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Cameron must disrupt parliament so a general election can be called. No sitting back "call me Dave" Nu-Lying-Labour must go NOW.
- Mike,, London, 08/12/2008 11:38
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Clearly, Brown cannot survive Cameron's weekly onslaught without the interfering influence of Martin. A very sad state of affair and a very lame PM.
- Tom, St. Albans, 08/12/2008 11:24
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This is a total disgrace. It further confirms Martin is in the Labour camp.
- William, Hampshire, 08/12/2008 11:22
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Speaker Martin is a disgrace to British democracy and should be fired. That Brown should support him is yet another example as to why he should be given the heave ho as well.
- William, London, 08/12/2008 10:58
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Where is your long touted integrity, Mr Brown? Fallen prey to narrow political interest?
- John, London, UK, 08/12/2008 10:57
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Absolute cronyism.
- Delphine, Oxford, 08/12/2008 10:47
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