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Public 'must be protected from passive drinking'
Anna Davis16.03.09
PEOPLE should be protected from "passive drinking" in the same way they are protected from second-hand smoke, Britain's top doctor said today.
Sir Liam Donaldson, the Chief Medical Officer for England, called for society to recognise the consequences of one person's drinking on another's well-being - a phenomenon he labelled passive drinking.
He also warned that Gordon Brown, who has effectively ruled out Sir Liam's proposal that minimum prices be imposed on alcohol, would have to return to the idea "sooner or later".
He said the Prime Minister needed a plan "with real backbone" - as did David Cameron, who also opposes minimum alcohol prices.
Outlining his annual report on the state of the nation's health, Sir Liam said it should no longer be socially acceptable to be drunk. He said: "England has a drink problem and the whole of society bears the burden. The passive effects of heavy drinking on innocent parties are easily underestimated and frequently ignored.
"The concept of passive drinking and the devastating collateral effect that alcohol can have on others must be addressed on a national scale. Cheap alcohol is killing us as never before. The quality of life of families and in cities and towns up and down the country is being eroded by the effects of excessive drinking."
Sir Liam, who first called for a smoking ban in his annual report in 2002, said alcohol affects families, the health service and the economy. He said: "The consequences of drinking go far beyond the individual drinker's health and well-being. Alcohol can cause harm to the unborn foetus, acts of drunken violence, vandalism, sexual assault and child abuse."
His report proposes a minimum charge of 50p per unit of alcohol, taking the cost of an average six-pack of lager to £6.
The Prime Minister responded by saying the majority of drinkers should "not have to pay more or suffer as a result of the excesses of a small minority".
Mr Cameron also said he did not want to punish drinkers, "particularly in a recession". He added: "It would hit people having an ordinary pint of not particularly strong beer after work."
But Sir Liam insisted: "Strong action on public health is always controversial. The report has only just come out and it needs to be debated and considered."
He added: "I got a hard time when I proposed smoke-free places I don't feel I have been slapped down." Sir Liam also said that fewer bars and clubs should be allowed in areas where alcohol-related deaths are high. "We need a proper plan to combat this. It will upset people and it will ruffle feathers," he said.
His other recommendations include more research on prostate cancer; better treatment for patients with chronic pain; more simulation-based training for doctors using models and mannequins; and for drugs companies to develop new antibiotics, because inappropriate use has reduced their effectiveness.
Reader views (44)
Passive drinking.....is that related to passive sex maybe ? or passive driving ? or maybe passive " goverment"?
- Charles, London
Drink up everybody, we'll have another round on the British benefits system, CHEERS!
- Bill, Belfast
First of all, I like a drink now and then. But it must be obvious to anyone that alcohol consumption - especially amongst the young - has reached unprecedented levels. The social and physical effects are disastrous for all concerned. The fact that I personally like a drink with my meal now and then does not blind me to the fact that alchololism has become epidemic in this country. When I was young, most people drank only on special occasions; birthdays, Christmas etc and young people hardly at all. I would meet my friends and we would drink tea, coffee or cola; nowadays young girls open a bottle of wine (or vodka if it comes to that) Only dockers and sailors drank (and even then only when they were working and had the money) in the same way that people do now on a regular basis. Get real. Drunkeness amongst all ages is out of control.
- Sirius, London UK
booz britian!
- Joe, London
They won't stop me. I'll brew me own if I have to.
- Sarah Bradshaw, Enfield, Middx
A radio caller yesterday pointed out that 10,000 people can get drunk at the Oktoberfest each year, and there is no trouble in Germany.
- Martin H. Watson, Teddington
What's next? Passive gas? I need protection from the fellow in the next bathroom stall.
The UK is now, officially, messed up. Someone needs to vote this guy out of office, or give him something real to worry about.
Good luck from Obama land.
Jeff
- Jeff, Chalfont, Pennsylvania, USA
Dear Real;
I live in Birmingham, and have seen first hand, the depravity to which people resort in the UK when they "go out for a pint". Compare our cities with the US and elsewhere, it is ONLY here that I see bouncers on the doors of almost every bar along Broad Street.
The UK has become nothing, and many people are deeply depressed to realize that they live in an ex-country, this and other realities fuel the boozing NOT the price.
- Hugh, Birmingham, UK
Incidents of public drunkeness are becoming rare here as the cost of a 6 pack is about £5 and an effective health awareness program by both local and federal governments have gone a long way to enlighten Canadians with the health issues related to alcohol consumption.
As much as I love Corrie street, they sure go a long way to make it look like a pint or 2 is not a problem.
- William O'Brien, Wolfville, Nova Scotia Canada
I'm suffering from passive politics. I neither drink or smoke but have to put up with one daft idea after another from this selfish stupid government. I need protection.
- Steve.W, B'ham UK
I live on a main road in N London where there are many pubs. I am a victim of passive drinking because my life is disrupted on a daily basis by drunken noise at best and huge fights resulting in serious injuries at worst. The least the local authorities could do is give people such as myself secondary glazing. I also have no doubt the people involved in this behaviour are a nightmare to live with and are awful neighbours, mothers, fathers, or kids.
- Real, London
This is just wrong. I weigh 11.5 stone ,I like the occasional can of ale with dinner or sometimes fancy a supersize bar of chocolate or a big bag of crisps at the moment all these things are good value. I pay my taxes and don't see why I should pay any more just becuase some members of society can not control themselves and the government cant think of any other way to handle it.
- Steve Armstrong, London
Is this man a doctor or a sociologist? He clearly has no idea of the sociological effects of prohibition! Or is he an economist with new and exciting ideas of how to make the NHS more cost efficient?
I really wish people of his ilk would confine their comments to their own field...
- Sue Churchill, croydon
Midwinoff of France - Getting drunk is NOT a "normal" part of growing up - it is a relatively new cultural phenomenon. Young people did not get drunk every week in my day; and it was unheard of for young girls to drink to the sort of excess they now do. I'm in my 50s and was not brought up in an especially sheltered way - but the sort of drunkeness you see today was just not encountered when I was young.
- Veranda, London UK
It is up to the individual to take responsibility for his/her own actions not the state. A person's personal habits are just that, personal.
- Tony_42, Canada
I haver actually been a severe victim of passive smoking all my life.
Both my parents smoked 40 a day each even though I was severely asthmatic and the doctors pointed out it was killing me and I lost a load of brilliant career opportunities in my twenties because I couldn't work in a room with a smoker.
But this is just a joke. The collateral damage of drinking on people around you is violence and that is already illegal.
Why don't you ask us why our lives are so grim we need to drink to get by? Maybe it's our lousy government and all it's nasty hanger ons.
Why don't you doctors treat people who are really ill instead of jumping on band waggons to get famous?
Don't you make enough money with all your nice drug company bungs?
When we are ill we get the bums rush. We get a "pain study" that says people with all sorts of pain aren't getting the pain drugs they need. We don't need pain drugs, we need the conditions that are causing the pain to ACTUALLY BE TREATED! Dur!
Not going to happen in this country is it?
- Thalia, London
Good grief!
My only question is, who will be making the most money out of this? The distilleries, breweries and wineries - or the government.
Just as the steadily rising cost of cigarettes has had little more than cosmetic effect on smoking (I'm a non-smoker, but I'm not blind!!!), so would this money-making exercise. It would just be Joe Blow paying through the nose, as usual.
- Rogan, Irving
So are they going to treat drinkers like smokers i.e. ask them to carry out their disgusting habit outside.
The sooner he joins the ranks of the unemployed the better.
What next, Passive Eating, Passive Breathing, Passive Living?
- Andrew, London
Now I've replied to this article I'm off to the pub ..... goodnight and cheers.
- John ,, Scarborough, N. YKS, U.K.
Here we go, white padded suits for all.
- Frank, Home Counties, England.
Quote - 'Three things would solve this problem: raise the minimum drinking age to 21, as in the US put an end to 24 hour drinkin'
These kind of statements fascinate me - where can you actually drink 24 hours in this country? Everybody loves to blame this law but I have never found a bar that serves 24 hours a day.
TAX TAX TAX - thats all this is about.
Bankrupt Britain being steered by Bankrupt Brown who will no doubt leave the UK as soon as he is kicked out of power to live in a tax haven away from the mess he has made.
- Monica Hall, London
Yes, the teetotal do need protecting from drunks.
- Anon, Essex, UK
Are we building up to a total ban on alcohol? I can imagine people going on binge holidays to countries where there is a sensible attitude to drink consumption.
- Mark Wright, Milan, Italy
He is absolutely right. Every culture seems to have it's anesthetic and it the UK it's liquor, unfortunately, which is associated with pretty well every instance of reported disturbance. For every drunken father there is a dysfunctional family and drunken teenagers are tomorrows parents. If they are not already!
- Cyrjames, Auckland NZ
Typical,..........Can't sort the individuals concerned with binge drinking, so lets use the "Shotgun Method", so the many will suffer for the few,..........Pathetic ideas from a pathetic Government!
On a personal note, It won't bother me, I'll just make sure I make more homemade wine from now on, won't be able to drink it all myself, but it will be handy to peddle at the party invitations I get, they all seem partial to my "White Lightning"!
GERONIMO
- Geronimo, LONDON MIDDLESEX
With the price of drink nowadays, there should be no problem as most low income people cant afford to drink in pubs these days. As an OAP I used to enjoy a drink and a chat at my local but now tats all finished.
T H lEEDS
- Thomas Hayes, Leeds UK
Teenagers wil always get drunk whatever the price of the drinks. It is a normal part of growing up.
Here in France the kids are educated about what to drink and how much. The average family allows a child watered wine at an early age,BUT they sit up at the table to consume it with their meal.
- Mordwinoff, Lisle France
Simple, start breathalising randomly at work and have those who are caught sent off for treatment. We all know people who stagger in late or come in stinking of drink most mornings. They are the ones with the real problems and random breath testing would make everyone think twice before getting totally drunk the night before. What you drink at night is your affair in my mind but it is my affair if you decide to come into work and I'm having to do your job for you because you are chucking up in the toilets most mornings.
- John, Aberdeen, UK
The Government out of touch with the public? Never!!
Passive drinking - this guy has a career as a comedian looming when Labour are kicked out!!
- Sally King, London
Kids can get ecstacy for £1 a pop, if you increase the price of a can of beer to £1 then more of them are going to take the cheaper option.
- Dave Eden, Sunderland
Alcoholism can have a devastating effect on those close to the 'patient'. However, altering pricing will have no effect. Some alcoholics purchase wine that is above the price threshold anyway and did not become that way through the affordability of alcohol. They got that way gradually, perhaps initially as a result of stress or other trauma. The solution is to offer those afflicted easy access to help (such as the AA) and ensure that doing so is regarded with respect not vilification. (People go into denial about drinking problems because they are embarrassed to admit it. But if it becomes 'cool' to get help, that would be a worthwhile use of taxes from responsible drinkers. Also, why hasn't anyone invented a drink that has the same effect as alcohol without the side effects? (We landed on the moon in the 60s, so we must be able to create synthahol!)
- Hmm, Interesting, Whereversville
Passive drinking should be dealt with the same as smoking.
It is already banned in the workplace. Individual offenders should be banned from drinking. This already happens in some areas via pubwatch where pubs cooperate and ban offenders.
This should be extended when drink offenders are brought to court, fined and tagged so that they can be monitored.
Innocent drinkers should not have to pay a levy because the powers that be have failed.
- Tomfitz, Loughborough
When will the Powers that be decide that smiling is forbidden.Surely the answer is to crack down on the drinkers who abuse alcohol rather than the sensible and modest drinker.This ludicrous Government brought in opening hours changes and refuses to punish binge drinking but will be won over to "taxing" as a source of income.
- P Doff, filey yorks
This is soooo predictable-once the health fascists had their way on smoking it would soon be the turn of drink to become the demon. The mad doctor should be taken to task for infringing human rights, and how is it going to be explained that alcohol is far cheaper in many countries on the continent; eg France, but people's behaviour in public abroad is generally far better? It is obvious that, if anything at all, it is supermarkets which need to be looked at, NOT pubs, restaurants and cafes, which in these crunch times need support-unless the British are set to become a complete nation of stay at home anti-social couch potatoes. (Mind you, politicians would love that-makes us easier to boss about.)
- Jon Kent, Hertford. UK
To tackle binge drinking and its associated costs on policing, health and a host of other services the government needs to repeal 24 hour licencing and bring back strict licensing laws.
Midnight should be the latest any bar or club is open near residential properties. Drunkeness should be criminalised and dealt with by the courts not just penalty notices. Proper resource planning could then be assured for hospital and the police etc.
Allow licenced premises to have smoking sections within their premises (if it is good enough for G20 attendees it is good enough for ordinary UK citizens).
Bring back private members clubs.
- Ranter, Maidstone, UK
I'm all in favour of his last recommendations - such as more research on prostate cancer and better treatment for patients with chronic pain - but the idea of just lumping more taxes on all of us is just too much. For myself, I'll just head over to France and pick up my beer and wine there. For people who don't live so near the ports, we'll just see much more black market booze. The problem with binge drinking is cultural, and taxing the rest of us won't solve the cultural problem.
- Anthony, Ashford, Kent
Three things would solve this problem: raise the minimum drinking age to 21, as in the US
ut an end to 24 hour drinking: make those who have to be treated in hospital for alcohol related offences pay for their treatment. They have not had an accident, they are not ill.
Raising prices will do nothing - booze is much cheaper in France, for example, and they do not have this problem there.
- Liz, London,UK
Is this man for real? In his proffession there are plenty of Psychologists.I suggest he consults a few for his pwn traetment. As with any excess attempting to price or exclude people from their addiction just doesnt work.Dont please quote smokeing. we have to be educated , policed ,led by the noseand shown the need to change habits.
- Peter French, Orihuela Costa Spain
This man has been implicated in so many silly proposals - presumably in order to demonstrate activity even if not achievement - that even this gimmick hungry government is not taking any notice any more. Passive drinking ? He's lost the plot.
- Peter Haldane, London
I think we need protection from passive unelected officialdom which seems to be getting over intrusive.
- James Elliott, Eastbourne UK
Sir Liam Donaldson really is the Gloomsniffer Persuivant. Who elected him the conscience of the nation ? He is the actual nanny in the Nanny State.
- Squiz, islington
It's about time the medical profession realised their job is to fix us when we go wrong. No more, no less. How we live our lives is not their business.
- Iain Clark, London
This idiot has done more harm than good. First with the stupid smoking ban and now with alcohol. Pubs and restaurants will soon not exist.
- John Smith, London , England
Much as I hate the term "Nanny State", let me make up my own mind how much I drink. Those who drink to dangerous levels and die are simply casualties of Darwinism, which mother nature has proven time and time again to be successful.
- Bob, Cheam
