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@David Short
They could get to South Kensington on the tube (for pennies, as you say) then visit the museums for free.

All the sights in central London are free. Could go and watch a debate in Parliament for free. Galleries there are also free.

Doesn't all have to be about blowing £150 on crap.

- Uptheboro, London, UK, 09/03/2010 13:13
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Who is making the use of the tube the measure of a good life? I work in a secondary school in Tower Hamlets and the majority of our students rarely use the tube, some of them have never been on it. But one reason for this is that they don't need to - they have grown up in the area living close by to most of their relatives and friends and going to school and college all in a close space. In some ways this tight community is enviable and far preferable to the commuter's life trekking from one end of the city to the other just to increase the pay packet. Of course I see where the article is coming from, but the fact is not that the teenagers want to travel on the tube and can't afford it - it's that they don't see any need to. And this is not necessarily the same as apathy - it's all about priorities.

- Hannah, London, UK, 03/03/2010 13:09
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Decency, London, UK - from what I can make out, the "right wing twits" comment is based purely upon the comments against the government for having allowed this situation to take place. If your solution is the same as the (failed) government handouts - throw money at them and hope to 'ease their suffering' or whatever, then you are not a part of the solution, but a part of the problem.

- Rogan, Irving, 11/02/2010 15:38
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A few years ago I took a bunch of kids from Surrey, aged around about 7, onto a train for the very first time. They had always prior to that been ferried around by car. This is not uncommon at the other end of the wealth spectrum either.

- Posh Person, London, 11/02/2010 12:02
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Send them on the Northern Line during monday morning rush hour.

I can guarantee they will never want to use the tube again.

- Simon, London, 11/02/2010 00:03
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What a load of rubbish these kids can roam free up until they are sixteen with their bus passes

- David Smith, london, 10/02/2010 22:15
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This government has allowed in 2 million immigrants from alien cultures, followed a few years later by their elderly dependants, and wonders why there are problems?

Future History books will note how this 13 year labour government wrecked Emgland.

- Richard, London, 10/02/2010 20:41
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I am sick of hearing his kind of thing.It is not an issue of money but of culture/attitude.As a former teacher in Inner London , teaching 'deprived' designer trainers children , who [30 years ago] never went on the tube.This was because they felt unsafe out of their 'area' [front line ?] , feeling [in their own words] they could be 'nicked'.Probably true.On one occasion when we took them to the Welsh countryside for a week , they absolutely refused to leave their hostel preferring to stay inside smoking ganja and playing dominoes.I kid you not !I suggest that the people who make these kind of pronouncements have not a clue about whom they are talking.While yet others exploit it for their own ends.So it was then.

- Chris M, morbihan,france, 10/02/2010 19:24
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What a weird article, and some even weirder comments. Yesterday this newspaper reported the conviction of a gang of eight who regularly robbed passengers on the tube. They were no doubt from similar, if not the actual, estates that are the subject of this article. Perhaps we should applaud those honest lads who stay put in their environment.

- Bj, East London, 10/02/2010 18:10
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Teenagers living in poverty, yes its bad! Their parents also live in poverty, most of the council estate in Britain people live in poverty, old age pensioners live in poverty, the real problem is, they do not know they live in poverty, its just every day Britain and our politicians don't even try to make it better for these people. Just keep letting more and more people into the country, to live in poverty. Poverty means the state of being extremely poor, these kids all have quote; "I bet they all have mobile phones and iPods etc" Phil, Surrey, he's right but Poverty also means the state of being extremely stupid, If the government spent more money on schools would this help? These kids have money, hence Phil's quote;what they really need education it's there in a cheap form; but they do not take it. I do not know the answer, But I know it will get worse, and then these kid will ride the tube. sad Britain.

- Fred, London, 10/02/2010 17:34
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O come on, never been on a train, what about a bus or in a car? Total ridicolous story and more deception from Labour MP's; the irony is that is this indeed true, they created this it. If this youth has not been on a train its because they are scared of the gangs and crime in their neighbourhoods all shipped in by their Labour government over the last 12 years, not that the cant afford a train ticket.

- Dirk Diggler, Soho, London, 10/02/2010 17:27
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Hmmm - Not sure about this article. Poverty of aspiration is the root cause of all this. I have a neighbour who has 2 kids - both have mobile phones, latest trainers, a plasma t.v in each room ( including the kitchen), a dog, 2 cats, 2 gerbils and a car. She is on benefits. Does she want her kids to have a good life? Yes she does. Does she expect them to go to school and learn? No, she does not! Why will they aspire to getting a good education and hopefully a job, when mum has done very nicely on benefits. POVERTY OF ASPIRATION! Her priorities are wrong and her kids probably have not been on a tube either - she can't be bothered to take them!!

- Maya - London, London, 10/02/2010 17:08
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Perhaps some of us "Home County Hillbillies" stepped out of the sink estates you refer to.

Public transport even helped us leave.

- Phil, Surrey, 10/02/2010 17:01
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To Decency

You might have a point about education. Over the last 10/12 years the Goverment's priority has been "Education, education, education" This has been financed by these "Home County Hillbillies" in their taxes. If these children do not have access to good education, why not and whoes fault is it?? The money has been there.

- Very Angry At Mp'S Expenses, Home Counties, 10/02/2010 16:57
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Yet again, we see the thick headed right wing comments coming from the usual suspects.

Some of you Home County Hillbillies should try and step out of your local enviroments and see that most people in what you call "sink estates" are actually pretty decent.

They want the best for their kids, just like you, they only difference between you and them is you have access to better education.

The middle class, social climbing twits in our country make me weep for this land.

- Decency, London, UK, 10/02/2010 16:33
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Weird mixed up story. I'm sure if they weren't so brain dead they could get on a Tube if they so wished, and are well able to pay the fare - after all most of the deprived kids I see in Hackney have mobiles, ipods etc.

- Mm, hackney, 10/02/2010 16:20
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I’m not sure that this issue is about money. My friend rented a flat on a pretty poor estate last year. Her neighbour (on benefits) had young children and over a school holiday just had the kids running round the flat. The weather was good but she just said she couldn’t be bothered to take them out. It doesn’t cost any money to take them to the local park or to one of the many free attractions in London. A bus is nicer and cheaper than the tube anyway so it’s a pretty duff story/report.

- Matthew, london, 10/02/2010 16:14
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Helen nails it. The one sure way out of poverty is a good education. Kids from rough areas are almost inevitably condemned to go to a hellhole of a school with no discipline and little chance of learning. The number one priority for this country right now should be totally overhauling the education system, with special emphasis on schools in areas like this.

Little chance of that happening though with people like Diane Abbott in government, who have presided over the destruction of what remained of school discipline while sending their own kids to private schools.

- Kevin T, Beckenham, Kent, 10/02/2010 16:03
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I have flown in a helicopter or been able to charter a private jet because I do not have enough money and have not been encouraged to believe that such opportunities are for me. Please can some MPs who have confused priorities and are desperate for some pre-election publicity look into it for me before it starts to affect my self-esteem?

- D Woodstock, London, 10/02/2010 15:55
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At least these MPs are admitting that 12 years of Labour government have done nothing to improve the lot of the
poor. Surely, they are not trying to blame it on Mrs.T!
Are we supposed to pay for them to take taxis?
I am the wrong side of 65 (still working and paying taxes) and I walk 4 - 6 miles when I want to explore areas of London I don't know well. I have a freedom pass, but I walk for the pleasure of it. Why can't teenagers do the same?

- Beatriz, London, 10/02/2010 15:35
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So what if they haven't been on the tube? I never went abroad until I was in my early 20s and no one called me deprived!

- Sarah Bradshaw, Enfield, Middx, 10/02/2010 15:29
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If you flood a country with more people than it needs or can house and handle, then the crush will make for more poverty and problems, not less etc.

Without so many people; there would be less unemployed, with less unemployed, and more employed etc; wages would rise, and so would living standards etc.

You have all read by now that New Labour planned mass immigration from 2000 onwards; in order to alter the fabric of our society etc; well they have succeeded beyond their wildest dreams, but this will include more poverty than ever; in my opinion.

Personally speaking; I think we are all being used in another British political favourite weapon of people control; divide and rule etc; if we fight amongst ourselves, we will not have the time to fight them etc.

As an old man today; I have seen many changes in my time, and again in my opinion; the Tories and Labour will continue to sell out the country, and its entire people.

I also think to tide of change is not far off; and a new radical party will emerge to defend this nation one day.

- Mickinlondon, london, 10/02/2010 15:27
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The reason we have sink estates in cities is down to Labour, this government wants people to live like this and claim benefits so Labour can have control over them and vote them back in Parliament. Labour should be ashamed of itself to let people in cities live like this. Instead of foreign aid money should be put into these estates and give people proper houses to live in and create jobs for them as well.

- Frances, Leics, 10/02/2010 15:23
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I wonder what it would take to get these kids on the tube, as someone has already pointed out there are enough schemes that a small journey off peak would ponly cost £0.65......Less than the cost of a loaf.

I thinks its perhaps more a reflection of aspiration and desire to travel on the tube not a lack of money. I lived and worked on those estates years ago so I well know what its lkike.

- Tony, Hove England, 10/02/2010 15:09
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So much for the "Brains of Britain" with their multiculturism.
What else have they got lined up for us?

- Davey_Bouy, Chertsey, 10/02/2010 15:03
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Put them on the damn tube and get it over with. Geee

- Bernard Ex Pat, Myrtle Beach SC USA, 10/02/2010 14:55
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Why would anyone get on the Tube unless they absolutely had to?? Deprived??? Privileged more like! I'll swap with them any day.

- Jay, London, 10/02/2010 14:48
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The working class are all fools!!

- Scotty, London, 10/02/2010 14:25
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This is nothing new, neither today on London council estates or in history.

If you are living on an estate in the east end or south London and you're a teenager, what on earth would you want to go to the West End for? Once you got there, for free on the bus or for pennies on the tube, what on earth would you do if you didn't have fifty or a hundred quid in your pocket? If you can only afford to sit in McDonalds, why go five miles to do so?

When I was a kid we rarely left our home streets either. I didn't go to the 'posh' part of my home town till I was 11 and passed my 11-plus because up there, where there were trees and people with cars, was where the Grammar School was.

- David Short, Tunis, Tunisia, 10/02/2010 14:18
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The bus is free to under 16's why would they pay to go on the tube...

- Sharon, Hackney, 10/02/2010 14:07
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What kind of crass headline is this and even more crass comments? Have you asked these teenagers if they want to go on the tube in the first place? The Tube is not some kind of leisure ride...it is a form of public transport people use, out of necessity and lack of choice, to get to their destination quicker. It is a modern day carriage which herds human beings to their destination. Some other people prefer buses - yes, it takes much longer (but then where are these teenagers rushing to go) but it is cheaper and you get to see more of London!! Before the government initiates a public inquiry costing millions of pounds over a period of five years into why teenagers don't use the tube - perhaps you want to ask them first.

- Liz, London, 10/02/2010 13:53
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And thanks to rich Eton boy Boris and his 20%TAX on the buses,the next generation will not have been on a bus either.

- Dave, london, 10/02/2010 13:42
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Throw away comment??? Phil - to say that kids in inner cities are knife wielding criminals jsut because they come from estates and have a culture that you don't understand is ridiculous...Most kids in, as you call them "sink estates" are essentially just like kids brought up in more privileged environments…It’s a lack of opportunity and empathy from society that contributes to some of these kids getting into crime.

I’m guessing you wouldn’t have a clue about the challenges that less privileged families have to face.

If this is true it’s a very sad state of affairs when something as normal as using a tube is out of reach for some Londoners

- Emil, Fulham, 10/02/2010 13:37
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Michelle,

To answer your questions;

Yes, lived in South London for 15 years and used the Northern line, central and Victoria line for work and socially. Still use the tube regularly.

Not a Daily Mail reader, normally a bit more left wing in my habits though as we are both reading and commenting on The Standard that makes us both DM readers doesn't it?

- Phil, Surrey, 10/02/2010 13:02
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Never used the tube? Got to envy that!

- David, London, 10/02/2010 12:57
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I suspect that this is more to do with social attitude, financial priorities of the children’s families rather than direct poverty. This Government has poured billions and billions into welfare payments, many schemes directed at the young. Islington to Westminster for a 11-15 year old, with an Oyster card is 65p – no Oyster then £2. If it is really s bad as Jeremy Corbyn and Diane Abbott say, then where has all the money gone???

- Very Angry At Mp'S Expenses, Home Counties, 10/02/2010 12:53
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Travel for an Under 15 is free on the buses and capped at £1 a day for the tube. There are many places that are free to visit in London. Cost clear isn't the reason for kids not being able to get around town - isn't it just a case of can't be bothered?

- Eddie, harrow, 10/02/2010 12:47
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I quote -'High housing and childcare costs which discourage them from finding work'. -Maybe if we went back to parents 'parenting' instead of looking to dump their children on someone else, the world would be a better place?

- Huggy, Cumbernauld Scotland, 10/02/2010 12:44
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I bet Phil has never been on the tube either....have you even left Surrey Phil? Daily Mail reader per chance ?

- Michelle, London, 10/02/2010 12:43
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Mark, my last point was a throw away comment and I would in no way suggest that all or even a majority of deprived kids are criminals. To support your point, the worst kids I have bumped into on the tube simply vault the ticket machines or get close behind a passenger going through one.

I stand by my other comments even if they are a bit sweeping. I think that Hleen of Norwich sums up a good deal of the issues behind the situation.

Money aint the problem. Low education, expectation and aspiration are at the root of much of this.

- Phil, Surrey, 10/02/2010 12:42
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The official definition of the poverty line in Britain is any family living on less than 60 per cent of the median income, which is measured by halving the difference between the highest and lowest incomes. The average family income in 2007 was £32k, so any family with an income of less than £19,200.

- Steve, London, UK, 10/02/2010 12:39
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I was born and bred on a Council Estate, so exactly where is this poverty? Poverty is not having a pair of shoes, going to bed at 4pm to keep warm because you haven't got a shilling for the gas, going down Covent Garden to pick up speckly applies because there is nothing else to eat. That IS poverty which my grandparents,and some Aunts and Uncles suffered. There wasn't any social security in those days. Today all kids have mobiles, i-pods, the latest trainers. Please show me the poverty in this country. The only poverty I see is where the parent(s) would rather have their packet of fags or bottle of booze and live off the state rather than feed, clothe, and take responsibility for their own kids!

- Sue, Kent, 10/02/2010 12:35
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Diane Abbott regarding "poverty trap" give me a break!!!!! The reason that the "wont" go out to find work is that the can easily sit on thier backsides and multiply like rat's while living on benefits!!!!!!!!!!!

- Stephen, London, 10/02/2010 12:33
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There are a lot of residents in south London who have also never been on the tube.!!

- Mr S.Port, London, 10/02/2010 12:30
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While I can understand the apathy that these youhgsters endure, I cannot help but feel that things might be better if the state could somehow ensure that the educational system created school leavers able to read and write, add and subtract, house keep, shop for ingredients and then cook a meal, and speak understandable English. This seems a very low aspiration, but currently even that seems unattainable. However, it would surely add to lives and opportunities. Sadly, that level of education – and higher - is available in almost every school in the land; it is the pupils and parents who corrupt it. As for paying for state nursery care, so parents can get jobs, where are the jobs? Like others, I am unclear exactly what is specifically meant by the government's use of the word 'poverty'.

- Hleen, norwich, 10/02/2010 12:22
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Phil, Surrey - your assertion that it's best to keep deprived teenagers off the tube is downright offensive.

Not every teenager from a difficult background is a criminal. If they were intent to commit crime on the tube, they would be doing so already. One mugging could more than pay for a tube fare, so to suggest that those who are intent on crime are not using the tube because they cannot afford it is ridiculous. The rest, who are not travelling on the tube, are the ones who need our help the most.

- Mark Lee, Vauxhall, 10/02/2010 12:21
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And all this AFTER 13 odd years of a Labour government.

- Matt, London, UK, 10/02/2010 12:04
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They're not missing much.

- Eddie, London, 10/02/2010 12:02
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I suspect a number of teenagers who can't afford to travel on the tube don't dare because they would be stabbed or shot for being in the "wrong" post code.

I bet they all have mobile phones and iPods etc. The problem with many kids on sink estates is that they, their peers and their parents have no interest in life beyond their environment. You can lead a horse to water......

Finally, having read yesterdays story of a delinquent steaming gang I can only feel relieved that more teenagers aren't running around on the underground.

- Phil, Surrey, 10/02/2010 11:50
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