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Call off next Tube strike, commuters beg union bosses
Dick Murray and Genevieve Roberts8 Sep 2010
Commuters today urged Tube workers to “consider their impact” on London and call off their planned walk-out next month.
They voiced their anger after the chaos caused by yesterday's strike. It came as union bosses warned of more action over job cuts.
Industrial action continued today with thousands of staff taking part in an indefinite overtime ban.
Union leaders said this would have a “cumulative effect”, eventually hitting train services.
The RMT and TSSA unions caused major disruption across the Tube network yesterday with a 24-hour strike over 800 job cuts to ticket office and station management staff.
Unions have ordered three more stoppages, the next starting between 5pm and 9pm on Sunday October 3 and lasting until the same time the next day. Further stoppages will take place at the same times from Tuesday, November 2-3 and from Sunday November 28-29.
The RMT said today they had learned that 250 of the 800 jobs had already disappeared after London Underground did not fill vacancies.
RMT leader Bob Crow demanded the practice of not filling vacancies must stop now or peace talks to try to avert further strikes could not take place.
He said: “Our industrial action is in protest over 800 job cuts which we believe will reduce safety and service levels for passengers. We have now learned that 250 jobs have already gone.”
But LU insisted the cuts would go ahead. A spokesman said: “We are willing to talk but we must change. We have been quite clear that one of the ways we will reach the 800 job cuts is by not filling vacancies.”
Howard Collins, LU chief operating officer, said that while he maintained the 800 jobs must go, there may be room for manoeuvre with staff changing jobs. But commuters called on the Tube workers to re-consider going on strike again.
Oliver Herbert, 26, a project manager for Royal Mail at Farringdon, said it took him two and a half hours to drive to work from Leytonstone yesterday.
“It's highly frustrating. It impacts on everybody, not just staff and I would urge the workers not to walk out. Negotiation has to be the way forward.”
Paul Mounsey, 31, who works for IBM, walked one and a half hours from Paddington to Liverpool Street yesterday. He said: “They should understand the economic climate, and that companies have to lay people off to make them as efficient as possible.”
City worker Kieron Delaney said: “They have got to consider the impact on other people who have no argument with them.”
Rachel Howard, 24, who works in a Kensington High Street spa, walked one and three quarter hours from Islington. “I'm sure they think they are fighting for the right cause, but it just disrupts London so much. It was chaos on the roads yesterday.”
More Londoners are now turning to bikes after trying two wheels yesterday.
Reader views (41)
"Oh Pepik, you really should actually read what thisislondon.com prints before commenting. The strike at Alstrom was about the 2% wage offer, the larger strike on LUL was about job cuts."
This is supposed to be some massive flaw in my argument? LOL! I hope you didn't strain yourself coming up with that.
"I know it is difficult and confusing to understand the difference between the two but it is quite important if you want to make an intelligent argument on the subject."
Sneer much?
"As for the Tube being an “essential service” according to Boris we aren’t; everyone can cycle to work so go ahead, “sack ‘em all”, who would notice?"
I'm not Boris, and why would you try using such a silly argument anyway?
- Pepik, London, 10/09/2010 22:00
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Oh Pepik, you really should actually read what thisislondon.com prints before commenting. The strike at Alstrom was about the 2% wage offer, the larger strike on LUL was about job cuts. I know it is difficult and confusing to understand the difference between the two but it is quite important if you want to make an intelligent argument on the subject.
As for the Tube being an “essential service” according to Boris we aren’t; everyone can cycle to work so go ahead, “sack ‘em all”, who would notice?
- ASLEF shrugged, Leyton, UK, 08/09/2010 19:44
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Colin, Barking, do you honestly believe RMT or any other Union will be broken? This is the rhetoric of the ignorant, Unions rose out of oppression and their strength is their membership. It is the dream of all sad Thatcherite dinosaurs and similar “Chicago School” Neo-Cons that they can crush the left and live in a world of total free enterprise, just as ridiculous as the Marxist dream of the workers’ paradise.
RMT rep, I will admit I have no idea how old Pat is, I can only relay the rumours I’ve heard off my RMT colleagues and God knows in my thirty five years of employment I have never encountered anything like LUL for rumour, gossip and bitching, this place is awful. Maybe I’m being feed information by the extreme “ditch Bob get Pat in” brigade, I have no idea, things are far more sedate with ASLEF, though the Battle of the Barbecue was amusing, we did manage to ditch Sweaty Betty and get Smilin’ Keith Norman installed as our “glorious leader”. When we stage Coup d’états at least we get burgers with it.
As for the rest, well yes, a graded reduction on staffing levels would have been more politic but let’s face it we are run by bean counters and pen pushers who sit in the Ivory Tower know as “55” who have little idea of what we actually do down here day in day out, they just nod like dogs and implement anything their political masters say regardless of the cost to staff or passengers.
- ASLEF shrugged, Leyton, UK, 08/09/2010 19:29
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"As I have said elsewhere it is always the unions that take the blame but never management who allow things to get this far."
It the unions that strike. Its the unions that make a commuting misery for millions of Londoners because they want raises during a recession.
And I stand with Vince - I am not begging the unions not to strike. I am warning them not to strike. I support an act of parlaiment banning strikes on essential public services, and the more inexcusable strikes the RMT calls the more people are going to stand with me.
- Pepik, London, 08/09/2010 19:14
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ASLEF Srugged, Pat Sikorski Cant stand due to his age and I have it on good authority Bob Crow has no intention of leaving and why would he? As for all the other comments does it not get a tad boring with the "RMT bad Bob Crow evil" comments. As I have said elsewhere it is always the unions that take the blame but never management who allow things to get this far.
Someone said the tube must have stringent rules & regs in place but even my LUL colleagues from ASLEF who have commented negatively must admit that these rules and regs are frequently ignored, Yesterday a station was left locked and unstaffed yet a train full of passengers stopped and allowed them out at Leytonstone. This is just one example of how "rules and regs" are often "forgotten" about.
- RMT Rep, London, 08/09/2010 18:05
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Time to opt out of ECHR article 11 then!
- Jim, UK, 08/09/2010 17:49
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Sack the strikers.
Employ unemployed graduates on temporary contracts who will be pretty happy on £42,000 a year.
Instal driverless trains, problem solved for ever.
Why do we put up with this rubbish year after year?
- Stephen C, London, 08/09/2010 12:56
Human Rights Act 1998 and Article 11 of the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) pehibits sacking lawfully striking staff.
£42k a year? Only drivers and managers get paid that kind of sum, and of course in your next statement you want driverless trains. Station staff earn circa £25k a year.
How much would it cost to install driverless trains? What would happen if the train breaksdown in between stations? What would happen if the cretins who throw objects onto the lines do so infront of a driverless train?
- Disgruntled Tube Worker, Watford, Herts, 08/09/2010 17:46
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"What's so good about capitalism then Frank?"
- National Rail Worker, London
Schools, hospitals, clean water, power supply, cures for killer diseases, democracy, constant food supplies, etc, etc, etc.
Do I really need to spell it out for you, or are you really that bloody stupid?
There is not one first world country that is socialist, not one. Wealth and prosperity benefits all corners of society. Compare the reality of poverty in this country with a third world country. You will find that people in this country do not know what poverty is. Poverty to you means not being able to afford Sky TV.
- Frank, Home Counties, England., 08/09/2010 17:28
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I should like to correct the view from ASLEF that things provided by the state are a)free and b) the product of socialism. State education for example grew out of the industrialisation of this country and its empire. Capitalism needed educated workers hence mass education. Transport grew from private initiative (e.g the railways) and i notice no-one refuses to fly easyjet or ryannair because they have lower staffs than traditional state airlines nor because they are not state owned. One might also argue that unmanned stations are already in existence and have not contributed to a lack of safety. the 'free' point is also wrong - the state provides goods and services out of taxation, taken from business activity, not out of thin air. Again capitalism has provided the impetus . socialism is about one group of people thinking they know better how to spend someone else's money on something that may or may not be socially necessary. unions by their nature are anti-social on the basis that you are a member or not and therefore accrue/dont' accrue based on selection not universality
- Peter Bench, London, 08/09/2010 17:12
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London Transport managers should take a leaf out of the london fire Brigade mangement hand book.
Even though the threat to the UK from terrorist action is at the second highest level of SEVERE.
London fire Brigade managers have started the process of sacking all of Londons firefighters.
That shows real guts,they are not even worried that someone will take advantage of there being no firefighters, to plant bombs.
They are totally confident of their plans for dealing with Chemical,Nuclear and Biological attacks that they do not even need firefighters to pick up the pieces.
So,come on LUL leaders,sack your workers and employ a totally new non-union workforce.I am prepared to use Shanks' pony for a couple of months until a new workforce is in place.
- Reg Bellows, Tooting, 08/09/2010 16:45
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Galland, Abeville – when I first started working on the Tube LUL answered directly to the Department of Transport, then we were passed to the Mayor of London, first Ken and now Boris. In that time the Unions don’t seem to have gained or lost power in any noticeable sense nor has there been much change in the “character” of each union, on the whole RMT go out at the drop of a hat while TSSA and ASLEF are much more keen on sorting things out around a conference table. The fact that TSSA went on strike the Tube for the first time since 1926 gives you an idea of how serious they think this is.
Anyway you probably won’t have to suffer Uncle Bob for much longer, he’s only got a year or so to go before he’s up for re-election and I’ve heard a very strong rumour that he’s going to retire. The bad news is that his likely successor, the Asst Gen Sec Pat Sikorski makes Bob look positively moderate. You have been warned……
Steve E, they can because it’s the law, write to your MP
ANdyr, nothing Boris can do, the law applies to the whole UK not just London, would need an Act of Parliament to change it.
To clarify the whole safety thing is about the number of licensed staff needed for a station to open and as ticket office staff are licence holders they count towards the total. The worry is that LUL will try and get the ORR to reduce the minimum levels and in the event of another King’s cross or 7/7 we won’t have enough staff to deal with things.
- ASLEF shrugged, Leyton, UK, 08/09/2010 16:41
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Aslef train driver,do you honestly believe that even if the RMT was broken,the LU management would leave you alone?.Scabbing gets you nowhere.Ask the Notts miners.You are building your own gallows.
- colin, barking essec, 08/09/2010 16:15
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Which is all the Unions are interested in. There is nothing positive about Socialism.
- Frank, Home Counties, England., 08/09/2010 11:59
What's so good about capitalism then Frank? I'd imagine there is plenty in it for the rich, but what about the poor?
No Mark,
it suggests that have an inflexible workforce.
- scotty, london, 08/09/2010 11:07
Actually scotty, that is not entirely true. First Capital Connect - a good example, was fully dependant on overtime working, otherwise the service would suffer. Every business relies on a small percentage of overtime, but not to such a high degree that if an employee chose not to take it, it would cause the service to deteriorate.
the bottom line here is overtime is an option and should never be made compulsory for anybody. After all, many of us work to live, and not live to work.
- National Rail Worker, London, 08/09/2010 16:05
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I never though I would be glad to travel on the Northern Line but I actually got to the office earlier yesterday, after setting out dreading the unknown - thank you Northern Line! Also we should thank the bus drivers who endure horrendous conditions during tube strikes, what with the traffic at a standstill and the disgruntled commuters wandering around like lost sheep!
- Tracey, London, UK, 08/09/2010 15:57
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Comrade Crowe describes these LU booking office clerks as being there for the safety of the travelling public as well as selling tickets and giving advise on ways at getting to a destination.
Has anyone ever tried asking these "St Christophers" for help or advise on how to get somewhere..you are lucky if you get a grunt
let alone a conversation from these load of muppets.
- Gary, Surrey, 08/09/2010 15:52
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ASLEF, thanks for working yesterday. As a commuter, I really appreciated it. Now maybe it's time to recruit disgruntled moderate RMT union members over to a more reasonable union...
- Liz, London, 08/09/2010 15:48
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Let them strike again and they'll find a mob after them probably..?
Hardly the behaviour you might expect in the 21st Century is it?
Can't TfL issue a lawsuit against the RMT for loss of earnings?
- Jim, UK, 08/09/2010 15:38
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Myself and all my Aslef work mates were in yesterday, keeping London moving as much as we could, but we always seem to get the blame!
I for one cannot stand Bob Crowe and his strike first attitude!
I just think he wants a row with the idiot mayor!
Aslef Tube Driver
- Aslef Tube driver, Essex, 08/09/2010 15:27
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"Call off next Tube strike, commuters beg union bosses"
Who has said that the Commuters (Customers) are actually "begging" the unions to call off further strikes? I wouldn't "beg" the unions for anything! And neither would any customers.
It's this sort of scaremongering propagated by the Media that makes things a lot worse than they actually are.
If the Media didn't report on the rantings of Crow and his cronies they would not get the publicity they are always seeking. Crow is dead in the water after the last two days. All he is up to is to have a fight so that the RMT flock can look up to him as an idol.
- Vince, London, 08/09/2010 15:12
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I think "ASLEF shrugged" makes good points - he has an inside view.
But the real issue is that the managers should be able to run the business in the way they see fit. The RMT is basically trying to run the company by saying who should be hired, and stopping any dismissals. They claim its safety, but its clearly not. The Tube must have so many rules around safety, managers would not be allowed to breach the rules even if they wanted to. And no one would want a big accident.
When Oyster came in it was clear what would happen.
The same thing happened with conductors on buses, and guards on over land trains.
To anyone with any sense, its transparent what Crowe is up to - he a) wants a fight b) he wants to look good for his members and c) wants to keep the membership up.
He has stated he wants a general strike.
The change Boris should make, is not banning strikes, but insist that a % of ALL workers, not those just in that union should vote yes. At the moment its a % of those that vote and a lot of staff dont vote.
- ANdyr, St Ives, Cambs, 08/09/2010 14:52
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I for one fully support the strike. We don't all believe in living by market forces and the odd day's inconvenience is a small price worth paying to see some small level of social justice fought for when so much is eroding thanks to the selfishness of the capitalist rulers of this country.
As for the comment "There is nothing positive about Socialism." Human beings can either work together or against each other. As far as I can see we wouldn't have any sort of society if we hadn't opted for the former. Socialism promotes working together whereas captialism promotes only the self and will ultimately destroy all of humanity's gains.
- Jon Duncan, London, 08/09/2010 14:52
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How can "a series of one day strikes" be classified as one strike , requiring only one ballot? On that logic Crow could call for monthly strikes lasting the next twenty years and never have to call another ballot.
No, if they want to strike let them go out "indefinitely" and see how long it lasts.
- Steve E, London UK, 08/09/2010 14:44
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It does seem that Mr. Crowe has a bit of a strangle hold on LUL. However, it isn't a simple exercise to sack the strikers.... we do have employment laws (thankfully) so there's no way we could ever do what Regan did with the Air Traffic Controllers in the US in the 80s.
- Paul, London UK, 08/09/2010 13:45
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"Ken talked to the unions and managed to keep strikes to a minimum, Boris promised to negotiate a no-strike deal but hasn’t even met them once in the two years he has been in office."
Yes ASLEF, Ken did & more often than not the unions got what they wanted and grew in power. Come on Boris, get that no strike deal going then the RMT can make that fat useless communist Crow redundant.
Oh how I will laugh.
- Galland, Abeville, 08/09/2010 13:44
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I'd like to thank the staff on the Northern Line, who kept it running with almost no delays for the whole of yesterday. I don't know how they've managed to do that, but many, many thanks!
- Grumpy B., London, 08/09/2010 13:43
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The new boss of Barclays will get about 100 million a year. So why should tube-workers give a stuff? I don't.
- Fred, London, 08/09/2010 13:16
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I rather walk 3 hours a day to get to and from work that LU to give in the that parasite.
I'm sure Crowe needs the 800 newly created jobs to bump up his 133k wage
- Clear, London, 08/09/2010 13:13
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"The RMT said today they had learned that 250 of the 800 jobs had already disappeared after London Underground did not fill vacancies."
So, no one's been sacked or made redundant, the jobs have been moved away by natural progression, I'd guess this is the way they'll do it when they fully automate the system and Bob's boys are out on their posteriors, here's hoping.
- Bob, Cheam, 08/09/2010 13:07
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TfL say there would be no compulsory redundancies but then they said there would be no job cuts at all so the staff are hardly likely to put much faith in them.
Bob Crowe doesn't give a damn about public opinion, all he cares about is keeping the support of the RMT membership and he will be secure in his position.
Scotty, I'm interested in how the need to do overtime to keep stations open equates with an inflexible workforce rather than not enough staff? It is hard to be flexible when we work within the restrictions laid down under of The Railways (Safety Critical Work) Regs 1994, the Fire Precautions (Sub-surface Railway Stations) Regs 1989 and a host of other laws which combine to make the Tube the most regulated railway system in the world.
As for nothing positive coming out of socialism, Frank, please feel free to pay the government back for the free health care, the free education and any other benefits you may have received from the state since you were born as they all came through the efforts of socialism.
As you may or any not have noticed ASLEF was not on strike and its members were doing their best to keep the trains running but then maybe you might consider that my union isn’t socialist as it doesn’t fit with your perception of what socialism is.
Ken talked to the unions and managed to keep strikes to a minimum, Boris promised to negotiate a no-strike deal but hasn’t even met them once in the two years he has been in office.
- ASLEF shrugged, Leyton, UK, 08/09/2010 13:07
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Sack the strikers.
Employ unemployed graduates on temporary contracts who will be pretty happy on £42,000 a year.
Instal driverless trains, problem solved for ever.
Why do we put up with this rubbish year after year?
- Stephen C, London, 08/09/2010 12:56
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"The RMT said today they had learned that 250 of the 800 jobs had already disappeared after London Underground did not fill vacancies. RMT leader Bob Crow demanded the practice of not filling vacancies must stop now or peace talks to try to avert further strikes could not take place."
The man is turning into a little Hitler. This is a standard management practice which allows an organsition to adjust the size of its workforce without any forced departures and as such he should welcome it. Is there any management decision that he feels he shouldn't control?
Imagine the scene at the negotiations: "either you recruit more people now or we strike". Beyond parody.
- TJ, London, 08/09/2010 12:36
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" Bob Crow said: “TfL must stop these back-door cuts.”"
In other words the RMT is striking to 'defend' jobs which don't even exist. They are not striking to to defend actual people in actual jobs, but to demand that the number of positions be created to increase the pool of dues-paying RMT members.
That, and of course they don't think a 2% raise is good enough during a recession!
- Pepik, London, 08/09/2010 12:34
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".. which unions said will cause further disruption to services."
Which is all the Unions are interested in. There is nothing positive about Socialism.
- Frank, Home Counties, England., 08/09/2010 11:59
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"LU said a normal service was running on all Tube lines today"
e.g. delays on most lines due to signal failures, cattle truck conditions in hot, overcrowded carriages, surly staff and rip-off prices.
But on a positive note, I would like to thank Bobby Crow for opening my eyes as to how easy it is for me to walk the 5 miles from my office to my London abode. I will be doing this at least once a week from now on, in preparation for Comrade Crow's future strikes.
- Nobby Clark, Perth, the Scottish one, 08/09/2010 11:37
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John David should remember that we've had 'more or less a Tory Government' in for the last 13 years or so. He more than likely voted for them. Does he think these disputes were not happening under 'New' Labour?
- Ted, London, 08/09/2010 11:35
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No Mark,
it suggests that have an inflexible workforce.
- scotty, london, 08/09/2010 11:07
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If an organisation requires people to do overtime to keep things working as they should, doesn't that suggest they don't have enough staff?
- Mark, London, 08/09/2010 10:42
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Shirk to rule guys
- Anglo, Sussex England, 08/09/2010 10:32
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With so many about to become unemployed overtime should be banned in all workplaces.
- Terry, London, 08/09/2010 10:00
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Every day they strike, the management should shut them out for a day. Just wait until we get near the Olympic opening day.
- shallotman, Basildon, 08/09/2010 09:57
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TfL have said that there will be no compulsory redundancies and are already not filling positions when people move on so the target of an 800 job cuts will be met sooner rather than later.
Moreover, when the true extent of the October job looses and cut backs are revealed in the public sector London Underground staff will be grateful they still have well paid jobs and overtime opportunities in an industry where there still remains some form of job security.
TfL don't appear to want to break the unions (unlike BA in the dispute with cabin crew) but that is only for the moment and remember we now have a more or less a Tory government in power.
Crowe should reflect that he and his union do not run TfL he is only there to represent some TfL workers and with the current economic climate any public support he may have had is fast disappearing because in the real world of business we are all aware that companies are now having to change many working practise and staffing levels just to survive.
- John David, London, 08/09/2010 09:41
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