• City comment: Insurance can solve benefits crisis

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I wish Ian Duncan Smith would quit he is trying to take away the welfare state with his crazy ideas. This government is the worse thing that could have happened to Britain. In the late victorian age freethinkers like Annie Besant fought for workers rights against an oppresive government. This government smacks of the same, repressive and totally dedicated to taking away and shred of self respect that the unemployed and elderly have left.
It is bad enough being old and unemployed without being victimised by a politician who quiet frankly is past it. Let someone else have that position better still scrap this mix matched coalition.

- FREETHINKER, SHEFFIELD UNITED KINGDOM, 28/06/2010 00:29
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hi Why dont the rich people of England help to clear the national dept why pick on the poor and the vunerable in our society

- Snowt in Trough, Sunderland, 06/06/2010 22:51
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Do not find a fault, find a remedy -
it is disgraceful to keep being envious of others, even if you think they do not deserve what they get...

That being said, workfare is slavery pure and simple...
and I am sure there will be a way to challenge it in the European Court of Justice, for a change let that work for the public, it just takes a person, or a group to file a case and create a precedent.
The defense: violating human rights for slave labour (working at a very low wage), no protection provision (health & safety), aggravated distress (bullying and coercion with threat of cutting benefits, again human rights violation) - as this will concern euro citizens, or residents, I am sure there are clauses within the euro laws that are several times breached by what Cameron, IDS, Nick Clegg, Vince Clegg and the other pitiful excuses as leaders are trying to implement here...
Fight for freedom from oppression and subjugation...
Leaders transform societies, they do not create victims...

- Nabil H, London, UK, 27/05/2010 22:59
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When long-term unemployed are offered work and turn it down because the pay does not exceed their welfare benefits, it is always assumed the job is too lowly paid. Wrong! Start on the assumpption that benefits are too high and should be reduced to that of minimum wage levels. Why should unemployed have any advantage over those who have to get up and go to work?

- Roy G, Solihull, England, 27/05/2010 21:00
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Ned, London

I dont get your argument are you saying the chinese re-invented slavery then, what else is there low cost manufacturing, as for IT I have a feeling the micro possessor was invented by an italian, is microsoft chinese? what is your point, the Chinese are dominating by copying others inventions and treating workers like dirt, plus factories churning out pirate goods, no way a civilised country can compete

- Peter Woods, Torre Chianca, 27/05/2010 19:17
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Margy, London,

I cannot relate at all to the adverse views of regional development agencies that you write.

The benefits of the development Agencies in the North East are there for all to see through many sustained and very productive manufacturing employment roles created, not to mention tourist growth of 30% in 5 years through their initiatives. They cannot be disputed.

Maybe their not apprieciated, needed, or as vital in Northampton as they are in more deprived areas of the UK.

- Allan, Hebburn, UK, 27/05/2010 18:32
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I disagree with what has been said about job creation; there is plenty of work that requires doing in this country whether it is cleaning up the countryside and areas not covered by councils or looking after elderly people if just clearing up their gardens. As well as providing a community service and making life better for everyone this will give the unemployed some skills and discipline. Eventually they are likely to be able to move into fully paid employment as the economy changes; they will have acquired references and got into the work habit. No-one has a god given right to sit on their backside and receive benefits when they can work. So IDS's idea is good - make people work for their benefit; yes it will cost more in the beginning but will pay off in the long term for all concerned - the unemployed, society and for those of us that work the knowledge that our taxes are being put to good use. This was what Frank Field wanted to do years ago but was stopped by Gordon Brown; at last a Tory idea I can fully support.

- Michou, Essex, 27/05/2010 18:24
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Allan, Hebburn, UK, 27/05/2010 15:28

Job creation is well and good if those jobs are wealth creating........if they are not then it is all a complete waste of time. This simple truth is something the left have never been able to grasp.....and still can't despite the utter mess they have caused (partially caused by creating unnecessary and unproductive jobs). A job has to be sustained and pay for itself otherwise it won't work in the longterm.

- Margy, London, 27/05/2010 17:55
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Peter: "What did they chinese ever invent?"

Well low cost manufacturing capability upon which we have based our mobile phone industry, our IT industry, our consumer electronics industry, our clothing industry...oh and a trade surplus which they lend back to our goverment to fund the deficit. Not really inventions I grant you but I think you get my point!

- Ned, London,

Nice reply and well posted; Ned.

Perhaps the British should have invented fireworks instead of the industrial revolution?

- mickinlondon, london, 27/05/2010 16:15
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Peter: "What did they chinese ever invent?"

Well low cost manufacturing capability upon which we have based our mobile phone industry, our IT industry, our consumer electronics industry, our clothing industry...oh and a trade surplus which they lend back to our goverment to fund the deficit. Not really inventions I grant you but I think you get my point!

- Ned, London, 27/05/2010 15:39
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peter,

If you can't compete with China and India you better get used to those chimney's (or whatever the green equivalent will be). I wish it was otherwise but we don't set the playing field anymore - the global economy does. I wish we could waive a magic wand and make those global competitors go way but we can't and they wont.

- Ned, London, 27/05/2010 15:32
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Margy, London,

RDA are not hated in areas of traditional High Unemployment like South Tyneside (9.9%) and have been a success story in the North East. Maybe they are hated in Northampton with unemployment well below the national average (about 4% or so at it's peak)

Areas like Tyneside and Teesside have benefited greatly and continue to do so, no matter how much certain people hate them in the UK Southern Suburbs.

Whatever your view of them, job creation and support is being taken away in needy UK areas at a time when they will be needed more than ever.

- Allan, Hebburn, UK, 27/05/2010 15:28
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@ Jamie, England, 27/05/2010 12:23

Mate, a degree is a worthy goal if you're interested in the subject and (ii) it will further your career/work opportunities. I am a graduate but looking at the market place today, I'd think twice about getting any degree for its own sake. Don't get yourself into 20k of debt to get a degree in knitting from Hull polytechnic. Apologies for sounding snobby but it's a fact that purely from a financial perspective, if the objective is to earn more by getting a 'good job' then those employers offering those jobs look for graduates in respected subjects from established universities.

Having said that, I believe it's only a real necessity for certain jobs like the professions (accountancy, law etc). In many, many industries real experience is deemed much more important - and that includes those like banking and other more sales-oriented services like recruitment consultancy, estate agency, customer service etc.

The bottom line is a degree will not guarantee you anything in terms of a job. It may give you some satisfaction and pride which is worthwhile. But by far the most important factor in your future happiness and success will be your own self-belief, determination, willingness to stick at work which isn't always exciting, and openness to connecting with people and opportunities. Believe in yourself. Review what skills you've acquired in work and life so far. Then get out there and sell them to people. You can do it!!

- David, London, 27/05/2010 15:22
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Ned, London

simple solution to the Chinese problem all the civilised countries bar there goods till they pay the right money, this is no level playing field, under your system kids we still be going up chimneys, we cannot compete with china, they have no developing costs, what did they invent , oh sorry firworks

- Peter Woods, Torre Chianca, 27/05/2010 15:14
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All this from the "Government" that is just about to cut 300,000 Public Sector jobs and whose policies will doubtless lead to many more losses.
I agree people should be encouraged to find work, but Governments should also be encouraged to create some jobs for them to go to.

- Barry, Welwyn England, 27/05/2010 14:58
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Wow, thanks for all the advice people, it's given me alot to think about, don't really know what to say other than that. I'm just going to crack on and really try and make something of myself.


@mickinlondon

I'm sorry if my comment about my father offended you, perhaps I worded it wrong, I realise there were people worse off than him. All I know is that when he was growing up in the 40s, his dad was a POW in Japan, and him and his mum had it pretty rough. Thanks for the advice though.

- Jamie, England, 27/05/2010 14:49
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Peter Woods:

And just who do you think will buy over priced products made by over paid people in a global economy? The answer is British people either have to compete with the Chinese or do something that the market values better than them. If they don't manage to do that they will have to get used to living 20 in a house or worse.Tough but the fact of live. No one owes Brits or anyone else a living.

- Ned, London, 27/05/2010 14:40
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Allan, Hebburn, UK, 27/05/2010 14:14

The RDAs are NOT successful and hated in many places -Northampton being one......look it up! They are undemocratic and can over-rule democratic council decisions. They should all be abolished and are a complete waste of tax payers money. There is absolutely no need for them. They are mostly run by labour party stooges who have little understanding of either democracy or economics. The employees of RDAs get huge salaries for doing very little other than a little paper shuffling and having pointless meetings all the time.

- Margy, London, 27/05/2010 14:28
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through the flood of cheap labour from abroad people are expected to work for less than 15 years ago, is this fair to citizens of the UK? of course not, do we expect our own to live 20 to a house to compete? I really hope not, its easy for people with good jobs often working for the government to call the unemployed lazy chavs, apart from a very small minority of mainly people who are drug addicts and boozers most people want to work, why should British people have to compete in manufacturing with Chinese working for low wages over long hours,our people are being ridiculed by all political parties, its time for charity to begin at home, British salt of the earth mainly, not lazy

- Peter Woods, Romford, 27/05/2010 14:23
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@ Mark, South East London
'On top mof this 80% of benefits should be paid in vouchers.'

I wholly concur with that concept.
_______________________________________________________

@ Jamie

Education is key, even if it is some vocational training course, you need to prove your commitment. I change careers late 20s went back to Uni and got a different Degree. Got onto a much better career path, paid of my student debts in no time.

PS: By putting yourself out in the work place you will meet more people and more opportunities will cross your path. Your mates who spend their lives on the sofas will probably die there.

- Frank, Home Counties, England, 27/05/2010 14:22
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On hearing this news, I feel more cheerful than I have done in years. I leave home at 7.30 a.m every morning and return to my home on which i pay a mortgage at around 7.00 p.m.5 days a week. My neighbour, lives in an identical house to mine, is on benefits, sits on her lardy backside all day, her house is a disgrace, even her nets are filthy, her garden is overgrown, her bins are overflowing, her fence has been broken by her own kids playing football against it. She has all day to clean her house etc,but chooses not to because she does not pay for it. It makes by blood boil every day. No one is making her go to work, her kids are all at school so she should be working. She says she has a bad back; well if she lost weight she could cure her niggling back ache! I imagine her sitting panicking about this latest govt. initiative to get people like her back to work. That makes me feel very happy

- Maya, London, 27/05/2010 14:21
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There's hardly a word on these boards about people who are GENUINELY dependant on benefits, those who are ill, or living in unemployment blackspots who will be given an unfair (sometimes impossible) ultimatium by this patchwork regime.

This Government plans to close the successful Regional Development Agencies in the North East and elswhere, agencies that really bring jobs to the disadvantaged regions of the UK. The success stories are endless. Look them up.

These agencies are an example of the precise help people need to get back to work, not a 'one size fits all' attitude to 'Benefit Claimants' who will inevitably suffer the very consequences of the Tory/Lib Dem Yes Men closures of Regional Development Agencies.

Yes - back to the 1980s.

- Allan, Hebburn, UK, 27/05/2010 14:14
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What i like about this is that Mr Duncan-Smith is not suggesting we stop caring about people who live in poverty or have become stuck in a rut with benefits. Rather he is saying that if we really care, then the loving thing to do is not to carry on with handouts that ultimately stop people from thinking for themselves. Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind. some people ned to be taught how to be responsible for themselves and that can be a very painful process but ultimately extremely positive.
I have friends who really deserve the benefits they receive and some that really don't.

- Jonny, London, 27/05/2010 13:38
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Can someone explain why people who receive long term benefits (MAJORITY ARE ON BENEFITS FOR A LIVING) are allowed to vote in this country? That should avoid the last shambles. Only people who put into the economy and society should have a say. Maybe people on benefits only should have half a vote in future to stop parties buying votes by keeping the great unwashed happy....

- DC, Ealing, 27/05/2010 13:37
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Well said Helen F - Jamie you obviously find it a struggle to improve yourself, but as Mick has said, it gives fantastic personal achievement and HAPPINESS! Your mates on the dole don't know they are living - there is so much opportunity out there and people who have never had that "drug" inside them will never understand. No holidays, having to worry if the cash machine swallows the card, hassle from the CSA etc is daily life for people who don't work. You have a brain, use it, but don't get frustrated....you have years to live and learn. I still think you wont be content until you pass a degree....it's your ambition, and it's a good one, so JUST DO IT!

- Rod, Epping, UK, 27/05/2010 13:24
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Jamie, London,
You have the right attitude, you do not want to end up like your friends who have no goals or work ethic. I have very little in the way of education, (I fell in with the wrong crowd) however I wanted to earn money and suport myself, I was brought up that way. I started in customer services and worked my way up, I now earn a good living working for a FTSE100 company and this has been through sheer determination and hard work, employees will be able to spot potential rather then whether you have a degree, my friends are all in the same position none of us went to uni and we all earn very good livings. Just believe in yourself, you friends may appear happy but I guarentee you they are not realising their true potential living on the dole.

- Helen F, Beckenham, 27/05/2010 13:12
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As a letting agent I have some tenants who have their rent paid to them by the local council. Rather than pay the rent to the landlord they opt to go on holiday with the money so the landlord with a mortgage to pay gets no rent. Simple solution to the benefit problem - you have to surrender your passport when you receive benefit and can only have it back in extreme circumstances. If you can't pay your way them you can't afford to go on holiday!! Harsh but essentially fair!! Most of the people who are benefit tenants of mine have a far better lifestyle than the tenants who work and they don't have to pay Council Tax either.
If the Government had the nerve to do this you would see the benefit applications drop like a stone!!!!!
Over to the bleeding heart liberals!

- Letting Agent, London, 27/05/2010 13:10
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Jamie; at 20 years of age, you have only just started to live, your father you say started at the lowest level, terrace house, outside toilet, no bath, started work at 16 etc?

Well Jamie, your father would have been considered posh and middle class in my day.

OK you might want a 5 bedroom house like he has, but you might never get anything like that at all, and I point out that as your dad gets older, he will not want or need his 5 bed house at all, and one thing is for sure, one day someone else will live in his house after he departs this world, nothing is forever; Jamie.

I understand your young frustrations at trying to succeed in to-days world; but from small acorns mighty oaks grow ‘’they say’’ and it is truer than you think today, you will grow in stature over time; as we all do if we are reasonably lucky, and defiant at the thought of any kind of failure etc.

Use your tearaway character as your defence, defiance, and rebellion, and never say never, and look for any openings to expand the true Jamie inside yourself, and I say that as a son of an ex soldier, who sometimes despaired of his rebellious son etc.

You are the master of your own destiny, Jamie; go for it, and try everything ok.

But if you want to know true happiness and total contentment; find the lady that will be the love of your life; then you will be richer than any man alive.

You see life is not always about wealth and position; its about being happy with yourself and your life.

- mickinlondon, london, 27/05/2010 13:08
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Jamie, England - I empathise with you, and can understand your predicament. I'd give you some advice - you obviously have intelligence, just from the use of English on here (much better than others older). Try to stop leaving jobs or getting sacked due to boredom or thinking it's below you (which isn't a slag-off, it happens often) - hold down a job that pays a wage you can live on, and do a part-time degree. You don't say where you live, which matters greatly, but if you always thought a degree was something you should have done, work and study and spend a few years biting the bullet...it'll pay off.

I am in my 40s and I am doing a 1 year full-time MBA, after 20+ years in business....if I can do it, anyone can!!! But work experience is just as important as having academic paperwork. Good luck mate!

- Rod, Epping, UK, 27/05/2010 12:43
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Like you Lee; my dad was ex army, polished boots and up at dawn etc, make your bed army style and wash in cold water etc, he even used to walk to petticoat lane from Maida Vale on Sundays, as the buses were not even running when he went out at dawn etc.

Work was everywhere in those days, Lee, if you signed on the dole etc, you had to sign in three times a week, if you missed one day, or was even late signing on; you never got your 30 shillings dole etc.

You could go from being a plumber to a painter, chippie to a brickie; depending on the jobs going etc, and there was plenty of jobs after the war etc, once I went for a painting job, never having painted anything before; and I remember saying to the boss, I have never painted before, and he replied, can you p-ss; I said yes, he then told me’’ then you can paint’’ get to work ok.

But that was then; today there are more workers than jobs etc, so even I would be turned down for a painting job today, without a university degree in ancient art and colour mixing etc.

You would also have noticed our bosses and companies send much of our work abroad, and you would have also noticed many more workers coming into the UK for jobs that are now being done in other countries, this expands the number of unemployed looking for jobs that do not exist anymore etc.

We were lucky really,we had work Lee; god help those that follow us today, they will have it tougher than we did, you can't really work without a job etc.

- mickinlondon, london, 27/05/2010 12:40
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Well IDS I admire you but you are going to face a struggle. The British have long held a view that they should be entitled to something. In the US the cab drivers will tell you how they use their earnings to invest, it is a very different ethic. Even the Brits who do work but who claim benefits know exactly how many hours to do before it impacts them. My mum who works for a retail chain in the office got a huge lesson in how these people exploit the system.

Much of this comes down to the immigration policy as well and unless this not only changes but we start kicking people out things really aren't going to change. I read before the General Election that any European who has been unemployed for 3 months will now be entitled to unemployment benefit. If true this is outrageous. We can't afford to allow every person who turns up on our shores to get every benefit going including dumping their kids on our schools without speaking a word of english and then the schools have to find translators. My friend who had brain surgery and had never claimed a benefit in her life was basically told she would be better off being an Afghan refugee if she wanted to get any help whilst she couldn't work. And this was just temporarily!

Its simple maths. We don't have enough of a working population to support the benefit culture without more cuts to frontline services.

So IDS unless you are prepared to take on the whole thing I'm afraid bugger all is going to change

- Lou, London, 27/05/2010 12:25
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What is wrong with food and clothing vouchers?

-----------------------------

Simple and a great idea, but how would it work?

I'm from a middle class background and went to a private all boys school, I was a bit of a tearaway back then (still am to an extent) and they had me expelled in the middle of my gcses, I moved to a state school did my exams and left school. When I finished I had no desire to carry on in education because frankly the private school I went to was more like a prison and it put me off for good.

I'm now 20 and must of had about 6 different jobs since I left school, I now fear I'm going to be in this situation for life. I don't know where to turn, what job I could even get where I could work my up to a decent salary without a degree. I have many friends who sit around all day on benefit and it annoys me how they get by just fine getting up at 1 every day while I'm in the office 9-5, but to be honest I've been tempted myself, they're happier than I am! I don't know how I can compete with graduates. My father started off at the lowest level possible, terrace house, outside toilet, no bath. He started work at 16 and now he lives in a 5 bedroom house, I fear I'm never going to get oppurtunities like he did simply because I didn't go to university, and that is what this country is.

I know this isn't the place to be looking for some advice but if anyone has any I'd appreciate it!

- Jamie, England, 27/05/2010 12:23
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It's just so obvious.

All the time they can get more in benefits than they can by working, then they will try to stay on the benefits.

The taxpayer can't increase their wages, but we reduce their benefits and make them conditional.

- SEJ, Reading, 27/05/2010 12:17
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In short, the rule should be that the NET benefits of any address should not exceed 50% of the national average wage.

Therefore, not only will this prevent multiple claims from one address but will also show that you are better of working than not.

We should not incentivise benefits.

- Hansel, London, 27/05/2010 12:12
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@mickinlondon

Yes I am proud that I fought to escape the estate but I think it helped that I was raised with a work ethic with both my parents employed. However at the time that was pretty normal, none of my frrends had parents that were unemployed for long and the ones that were were due to illness. This was thirty or thirty five years ago. Now it seems the norm that people have given up trying or wanting to find employment there.

- Lee W, London, 27/05/2010 12:05
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Mick in London, Cassandra


Ditto!

- M, London, 27/05/2010 11:27
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Good luck IDS mate, you're going to need it.

Brace yourself for an onslaught by the hordes who make their living one way or another from promoting welfare dependency.

I'm talking about Guardian/Independent leader writers and ‘opinion-formers,’ think-tanks, pressure groups, rabble-rousers, self-appointed moralists and community ‘leaders,’ hand-wringers who infest media panels and talk-shows, public sector union leaders, bureaucrats in non-jobs, and especially the BBC.

- David, Doha, Qatar, 27/05/2010 11:27
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@ Lee W, London.

It's not just Manchester but all over. I was brought up on a Local Authority housing estate in Birmingham during the 50s and 60s and where almost every adult was working in some capacity or another. My parents worked hard so that they could buy their house from the Council, and still live in it today. I recently visted them and was shocked to find that out of the 12 properties in their small road only one family was in any sort of employment, the other 10 were young families with several children all on benefit. To add insult to injury my parents, now in their 80s, are the only residents in the street paying the full rate of council tax and all their own utility bills. And because they have modest savings they are not entitled to any benefits other than those universally available to all pensioners of their age. They are the losers in all of this simply because they worked all their lives to provide for their family and now they are seeing their hard earned savings being used to support those who have chosen a life of unemployment and benefit dependancy. My parents are traditional working class people who have been robbed by 13 years of a Labour government and now the Conservative/LibDems want to continue in the same way.

- pip, Epsom UK, 27/05/2010 11:19
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And if they refuse, they lose their dole. How come we have people imported from Eastern Europe doing this work in Croydon?

- Croyboy, Croydon, UK, 27/05/2010 11:

I think that you will find its called " positive discimination " - In my borough all the dustman are African ?

- Grim Reaper, Hell, 27/05/2010 11:18
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A complicated situation, Lee; the mother and father are probably now beyond help now, but the children are not beyond help, these children will know and remember their childhood, and the odds are that most of them will progress into a better life in their future, than the only life they have ever known today etc, but some of them may end up like their parents etc.

You say you yourself grew up on an Estate; yet you are not like that family, even though your parents were probably no better off than that family is today etc, and you lived in the same environment as well etc; but you moved on, and so can some, if not all, of those eight children can move on as well.

I know a lot about poverty, I was born in the middle of WW2 and food and a home was very rare for the poor in those days; but we were lucky really, we could not afford to drink then, if we could have afforded alcohol, I think many of us would have got drunk just to escape the reality of poverty, death and destruction, and no hope of any kind of life etc.

When I see a tramp; I always think that he must have a family somewhere, he is, or was, some mothers child, maybe he has brothers and sisters etc, he may even have children of his own, then I wonder why he has ended up like that etc; knowing that it could have happened to me, but for the grace of god, and my defiance to defend myself against all etc.

Life is easy for some, Lee, but impossible for others less fortunate; but you have thought about it Lee.

- mickinlondon, london, 27/05/2010 11:14
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Can someone tell me: what on earth is wrong with requiring the fit long-term unemployed/never worked to turn up at a council depot to be sent out sweeping the streets, cleaning, or picking up rubbish a couple of times a week? ...And if they refuse, they lose their dole. How come we have people imported from Eastern Europe doing this work in Croydon?

- Croyboy, Croydon, UK, 27/05/2010 11:01
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The estate where I grew up in Manchester is full of families that don't work and don't want to work.

Opposite my Mum now is a family with 8 children where both parents are alcoholics and neither have ever worked. A couple of years ago they moved everyone out of the house into a hotel for a month whilst the whole house was redecorated.

What are the chances that their children will want to escape that life?

- Lee W, London, 27/05/2010 10:38
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Maybe the long term unemployed should be given jobs in the public sector until they can find alternative employment.
They could be given on-the-job training and maybe even be given day release to learn new skills that could get them a job in the private sector.
This would have a double benefit that we could reduce the cost of the public sector by using the long term unemployed and give these people the chance to make a contribution to the country and give them a meaning to life.
We should also look to stop paying benefits in cash that can be used to pay for luxuries such as mobile phones, sky TV, alcohol and tobacco. What is wrong with food and clothing vouchers? It is ridiculous to hear of people getting benefits of tens of thousands of pounds a year. No wonder the country is billions of pounds in debt.
Let's help people, help themselves - not pay for them to live in relative luxury at the expense of everyone that works.

- Matt, Bexley, 27/05/2010 10:28
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Quote: It also reveals that income inequality in the UK is now at its highest level since comparable statistics began in 1961.

This statement alone is valid as to being trapped in a poverty trap etc; if by any chance a worker could earn even £15,000 a year, and say this worker lived on a council estate with rents that are in the £150 a week range without rent rebates; this halves the workers wages straight away etc; then add council tax which is far worse than the old rates system as far as cost is concerned, then add tax and insurance to the deductions of the workers wages, the worker would take home less pay than the dole money and rent and council tax allowances give them etc.

This spiral of illusions starts with keeping workers wages low, then increases faster by increasing rents and service charges of low paid workers etc; which in turn means more rent and council tax rebates being claimed and granted, which in turn means more taxpayers money needed to finance this spiral decline, which in turn, means that the other workers on higher wages, finance businesses that pay workers low wages, which in turn means business makes higher profits for wealthy shareholders etc, and the worker decides to stop bothering with a system that he or she cannot beat until wages become worth earning, just to maintain their lives of poverty etc; and so it goes on, until a fair days pay is paid for a fair days work etc; even bankers threaten to leave the country if they are not reward

- mickinlondon, london, 27/05/2010 10:13
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Finally lets hope something is done with these layabouts!!
Why has this countries work ethic diminished beyond belief??
When I was at school I did paper rounds, milk rounds, worked in a shop on weekends to help finance things for myself which my parents couldn't afford. This ethic has been engrained on me ever since.

I was unfortunate to lose my job last year and it was the worst feeling I have felt in my life to date, I felt I was letting my wife & children down. I spent every day searching for jobs or going for interviews as a mission to get back to work asap, which I managed within 4 months, which looking back was a horrible period of my life.

The very obvious thing I noticed was that during my fortnightly visit to sign on for my £65 per week, I wanted to avoid everyone as I felt ashamed that people could be looking at me walking in the Job Centre labelling me as 'jobless' etc. There were others who were also signing on that would walk in and know all the staff on first name terms and likewise the staff knew them.....how long had they been going there? To compound things, the workers would be trying to get them to go for jobs and you knew there was no interest about getting a job, they just wanted their cash, or should I say our cash to spend rather than get off their backsides.
Until we reform our system and stop benefits all if people refuse to work, and giving them the same lifestyle as some lower paid workers, how will we ever get out of this mess??

- Paul, Enfield, 27/05/2010 10:13
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Yes, we must call time on benefit cheats and those who exploit the system at the bottom of society. But we must also stop wealthy individuals at the top who use accountants to dodge tax and companies, particularly banks, who use creative accountancy to do the same and yet receive massive bail-outs.

- Cassandra, London, 27/05/2010 10:08
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Winston Churchill commented on the welfare state when he said '..he was in favour of a safety net, below which no one should be allowed to fall, and beyond which people should be able to do as they wish...' The level of the safety net has now been raised so high that it can now be used as an alternative to seeking employment, and in too many cases the various benefits available amount to a level of income that execeeds that of many in full time employment.

- pete, coulsdon uk, 27/05/2010 10:04
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Frank,

Don't forget that the ES in their "The Dispossessed" crusade cited that Barbara Harriott from Catford/Lewisham was receiving £ 38,000 pa (equiv. 56k pa paid job) in bens and tax credits for laying on her back and banging out kids at an alarmimng rate.

She had the cheek ro complain that she couldn't afford school shoes for kids, whilst at the same time saying she spent £ 20 pw on phones and £ 100 a month on Sky TV!

The maximum benefits and tax credits anybody should get should be limited to the higher of a) their ave. net income for the last two years or, b) average earnings less a notional deduction for income tax and national insurance. On top mof this 80% of benefits should be paid in vouchers.

- Mark (will never vote Labour again), South East London, 27/05/2010 09:50
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Living of benefits should NOT be a lifestyle choice. Especially for individuals who have contributed nothing towards our society. It is an insurance for those who fall on hard times.

Time to weed out the very many social leeches.

- Frank, Home Counties, England, 27/05/2010 09:23
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There has been a marked change in work ethic since the 1960's and many now feel more conscious of their self-designed 'rights' rather than any sense of responsibility.

Why do we import 100's of thousands of East Europeans to work in agri-harvesting - the sort of work I used to do at weekends and during school holidays?


So maybe IDS is right, but

- Anglo, Sussex England, 27/05/2010 09:18
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